I'm Terrified of AI

Anyone want to talk about AI? After all, it is going to change life as we have known it for the past millennia. It is in my opinion the biggest thing to happen to mankind since the discovery of fire - and probably much, much bigger. I find it fascinating. How could you not? It's epochal, beyond epochal. I'm not sure we have an English word that adequately describes it. And it's all going to happen soon. It's moving faster than exponentially at this point - it's growing geometrically. And I find it absolutely terrifying - I actually hate it. It will eliminate everything that we use to define ourselves as humans. I'm astounded that we can unleash such a force so mindlessly. I guess Moloch wins in the end.

John

https://youtu.be/nUiuwd8KZOg?si=s-jcOodLyRARUuYN&t=1147

Especially, since
it is not necessary.

everyone who thinks AI will make this world a better place for us to live in is wrong ....it will only speed up the end of civilisation...IMHO

it will exploit what is most valuable to mankind,..... its faith
you have been seeing in the last few years how stating a false narrative and maintaining it produces a belief in that false narrative.

I'm starting to think that there are two distinct kinds of people: those who think they are god; and those with humility that realize they are not God. I suspect it's the first group that's building AI, creating their own god. I think that AI, especially AGI which is imminent, has far more existential risk than nuclear weapons.

Wisdom is the principal thing; therefore get wisdom: and with all thy getting get understanding. - Proverbs 4:7

And in another context:

Give all the power to the many, they will oppress the few. Give all the power to the few, they will oppress the many. - Alexander Hamilton

I think many applications will be helpful while others will be devious. I can only hope that there will be plenty of good, smart people to combat the devious ones.

It's a kind of dual threat. The bad guys can use it in malevolent ways. And the AI can go rogue ("I'm sorry Dave, I can't do that.")

I recall seeing 'The Changeling'.. first broadcast Sept 29, 1967. Homes often needed roof antennas to receive a semi clear signal, and frequent adjustment.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dIpsvF50yps

I would characterize it as akin to nuclear energy. Used with good intent it can provide vast quantities of energy to power a more productive civilization. The flip side is that it can also be used as weapons to destroy civilization. The use of fire was the same way when first used. AI can be used to dramatically improve healthcare or better devices. It can also be used to better deceive us or steal our identities.
It all revolves around the intent of the user. The problem it seems to me is the growing number of individuals and groups who only want to cause harm to others.

I'm with Dave on this in regards to the intent of its usage.
My daughter prior to Covid was acting in LA and was chosen as a face to be used for IA in regards for 'in bank' information terminals for customers.
I believe she gets a monthly payment for the duration of (is it her face??) usage but it's a pretty spooky kind of world we all live in now.
M2CW

i believe we have been living in the effects of AI for more than a decade.
social manipulation has taken place thru ought the continent's.
You see the damage it has done in the "what the hell" results of elections such as brexit etc........

I’m more terrified by lack of human intelligence in so many facets of life than I am about artificial intelligence

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Originally Posted by bob joyce

i believe we have been living in the effects of AI for more than a decade.
social manipulation has taken place thru ought the continent's.
You see the damage it has done in the "what the hell" results of elections such as brexit etc........

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And that's a BB gun compared to a Nuke.

JA

Quote:

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Originally Posted by 911MRP

I’m more terrified by lack of human intelligence in so many facets of life than I am about artificial intelligence

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I'm with you but not terrified, more like appalled. The dumb ones aren't dangerous. It's the malevolent smart ones that we need to fear. Never in the history of the world has one person had access to so much power. And that's just the part about bad guys. Another aspect of these powerful tools that are controlled by so few is that they will eventually have all the wealth. Humans are becoming obsolete as tools of production at many levels. And the riches - and the power - go to those who own the tools of production. Mark Twain said (I'm paraphrasing) "If the power resides in the hands of many they will control the few and if resides in the hands of the few they will control the many.". Hell, with AGI it would take fewer people to run the world than it does to staff a football team.

JA

I'm going to continue to poke this. Why? Because it's the biggest development in the history of mankind. It is going to change human life as we know it. Just because you can do something doesn't mean you should. The AI industry is increasingly being driven by stupid intelligent kids without a hint of wisdom because old folks are worried about the existential threat and are leaving.

You can assume that companies like Open AI have *way* more advanced technology than they're showing us. This is an arms race and there is a great deal of secrecy. And what they are showing us is already terrifying. SORA, for example. It blows your mind, but what good is it? It's going to eliminate graphic designers, stock content companies - and many others. Why is this good? Just because you can do something doesn't mean you should.

Sure, just like nuclear technology, it has the power to do many good things, such as revolutionize the health care industry. But, as with nuclear technology, how does it come out when subjected to a benefits analysis? It seems to me that if one of the negatives is extinction of the human race or destruction of life as we know it, that it should carry a bit of weight, no matter how many positives there are.

It's a perfect example of the Moloch Syndrome, a race to the bottom. If you're not familiar with Moloch the essay "Meditations on Moloch" explains it well. It might be old hat for you but for me it was a revelation and elevated my understanding of humanity and what makes it tick.

This is the most significant change in the history of mankind and that ain't hyperbole. At 80 years old, I'm checking out of here in the not too distant future. But worrying about my grandchildren makes me sick to my stomach. I'm not sure how to help their parents prepare their children for the radical changes ahead that will affect every aspect of their lives. It troubles me that so many people spend their time watching football and other trivial distractions while the world around is in the early stages of complete transformation.

Cheers,
John

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Originally Posted by 911MRP

I’m more terrified by lack of human intelligence in so many facets of life than I am about artificial intelligence

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i hear you, however AI is yet another tool to be used for the world's most questionable & devious humans. in my industry we are already utilizing AI fraud prevention tools, as the fraudsters are already demonstrating a high degree of skill using this technology for fraudulent activity. it is scary how difficult it is to discern fraud created by AI - even in these early years of the technology.

So.... Moloch..... The chip on the shoulder and the misguided belief that a social movement may remove it.

From the same great people that brought you social media.

I was talking to my son the other day about technology. He has been a technologist all his life and watches things closely. Born in 1970, his observation is that things have been declining in the U.S. since he was born, and probably for a few years before. We agree it began around the time of the Viet Nam War (not caused by that event - this is social commentary, not political). We looked at each other for a moment and had the same thought at the same time. The biggest change over that time? Technological "advancement". Coincidence? Correlation? I think there is much correlation for many reasons that are too numerous to list here. And now the advancement of technology goes, not into overdrive, not into exponential growth, but into hyper-warp geometric growth. Moore's Law seems like horse and buggy stuff. The human mind has a hard time comprehending exponential growth, much less geometric growth.

It's important to remember that this is an arms race and most of us are not fully informed as competing AI developers are showing us only the tip of the iceberg. One of the developers at Open AI posted a comment that they are releasing things slowly in order to gauge the public reaction. And the reaction to SORA (the mind blowing new technology that generates life-like video from word prompts using the Large Language Model (LLM) - check it out if you haven't done so already) has been surprisingly negative.

We may be entering an era of activist Luddites as AI is evoking a strong reaction (particularly from those who have trained all their life for a job that will soon be obsolete). So, add civil unrest to the many other things to worry about regarding AI advancement. For example, an autonomous taxi was burned in San Francisco a few days ago. Activists have also taken to placing traffic cones on the hoods of autonomous vehicles as it confuses the vehicle and it won't move until someone from the company comes out and removes the cone.

And lastly, in case you missed it, Sam Altman at Open AI is seeking $7 TRILLION in venture capital funding. Evidently chip fabs are unable to keep up with demand and he wants to go on a building spree. How much is $7 trillion? Who knows, but here’s one effort to make it more tangible. Let’s say that one dollar equals one second. You have been cruising along in your spaceship for 7,000,000,000,000 seconds (which equals 220,822 light-years). You have broken out of the Milky Way and you are nearing the Andromeda Galaxy. It may or not be troubling that oil-rich Middle East nations such as UAE are interested.

Amazing times we live in, eh?

Cheers,-
John

I wondered out loud what things will be like when my newborn granddaughter is my age. The mind reels.

https://youtu.be/Qa-4Y6FRKF0?si=7dqAxC3orrYfcEuI

There is just too much financial upside that keeps even people like Musk who worries where this might go to walk away from it. Developing this technology and the power they will have over us is like a drug for these folks. If we thought we had no privacy before, this will be on a whole new level. I’m watching the Country I love going down the drain. To me AI has more potential downside than upside.

Learning about the Moloch Syndrome was an epiphany for me, no exaggeration. It's a simple concept that involves mainly greed and pride but explains how mankind so often gets involved in seemingly non-logical loss-loss behavior in a race to the bottom. If you aren't familiar with the concept please consider reading the extraordinary essay "Meditations on Moloch". The person that has been most active in discussing it is Liv Boeree, a very bright English woman who of all things used to be a successful professional poker player and now is becoming a keen social observer. It's really starting to gain traction and I see it discussed more and more as we all seek answers to why mankind so often acts against its own interest, which is seemingly such a contradiction.

I referenced it before but AI development is a perfect example of Moloch. There has never been anything in history that has the potential to concentrate incalculable wealth so tightly in so few hands. After all, owners of the tools of production make the money. And not only does AI severely the number who own the tools of production, in many cases it makes human beings obsolete as tools of production.

And perhaps, more importantly, it also concentrates incalculable power in few hands. There is just no way that man can avoid abusing this technology, on many levels. I spend a lot of time trying to come up with strategies for my grandchildren on how they can deal with. So far, other than maybe living self-sufficiently in some remote place, I'm coming up empty.

The obligatory thing when criticizing AI is to laud it for contributions that it can make to things like health care. Which is true and we can place that on the pro side of the benefits analysis table. But when you actually list pro's and con's it's pretty obvious, except to the most optimistic, that we're screwed.

JA

Time to read through my Kurt Vonnegut collection again. Ahead of his time.

Meditations on Moloch is areal rabbit hole!

As you have probably noticed by now, I enjoy reading and synthesizing the information by writing about it. I had an idea and I wanted to gauge your interest.

If I were to publish a periodic (newsletter, I guess) containing my ramblings on Artificial Intelligence, might you be interested? I'm not a scientist and I'm using that to my advantage as my point of view will be as an informed layman. It can be tough sledding at some of the more formal AI forums and my goal is to just be informed and, as I think this is a critical development in the history of mankind, share it with others who are interested. The ultimate goal is to increase awareness as I think it's critical to be informed on this topic, especially if you're younger than me or have a family.

If enough are interested I'll go ahead and set up a little website where you can subscribe. There is no intent for this to be used for commercial use at this time and your personal information will *never* be shared with anyone. Just shoot me a PM or email if you're interested.

Cheers,
John

The AI Discussion Group has launched and two issues have gone out. You can preview an issue HERE and sign up HERE if you're interested.

Thanks,
John