Newbie buys crappy old porsche - now what?

[Scott Clarke]

Ike,

Welcome to the best car forum I know of! I am happy to have a look at the car if you would like me to. I think a good step would be to see if you can get it started. 2.2S motors are great things. If it has the correct pistons, cams, cylinders, heads, crank, and rods, and if it has decent compression, it bodes well for your adventure. If it doesnt, then you are already looking at an uphill battle. This forum has a lost and found thread stickyed at the top of the page. You could list the case as available. People are trying to reuinite S cars with their original cases all the time. Someone may be seeking yours, regardless of the condition of the rest of the motor.

You are no stranger to rust, so likely have a good idea of what you are up against there. Various superficial parts are quite expensive, making putting a complete car together expensive, even for someone with the extensive skill you have. Comments above concerning budget are correct.

I sure wish I still had mine.

You know where to find me. Let me know if I can help.

[robmog]

FWIW, As a reference point.
My car was in similar non running condition.
As a complete DIY project, the rust repair and engine rebuild(worse case scenario) cost over $25K.
(that's the number I tell my wife)
I started 10 years ago and everything is more expensive now.
Slippery slope indeed

[Richardnew]

Do not start taking the car apart.

Try to get the motor started - do that very carefully and ask for help.

Next the car will need to stop. Flush the brake system and see if you get a pedal.

You're going to spend a bunch of money on this car. I had a little bit of rust - compared to your car. It cost over $10,000 to get the rust taken car of properly. Here's a link to my rust project.

A restoration on this car could easily break $200,000.

I'm currently doing torsion bar bushings on the front of my car. I'm well over $1,000 at this point and it's not done.

These projects have a way of getting out of control. Get the car running first. Drive it for a while - if you can.

Richard Newton
The Money Pit

[76911S]

In my opinion, I would not try to get a car running and driving that spent "many years" in a pasture. Systems need to be dissembled, replaced or rebuilt, not just coxed to maybe work. That could cause bigger problems in the long run. Think rust in the oil tank, sludge in the calipers and master, not to mention what might be in the fuel tank and carbs or injection etc... Steering rack, tie rods, gearbox, on and on...

Mark..

[drwhosc]

Take your time, do the work yourself, don;t go for a show car, go for a driver. Parts are crazy, and will make you cry.... 5k will go quickly...

[LongRanger]

And another threade --- from 2 years ago . . .
http://www.early911sregistry.org/for...S-what-do-i-do

. . . doing 85% of the work myself, I'm about 20% complete, and I'm already 100k into it . . .

On the other hand . . .

. . . if you do do most of it yourself, then you can go from this

Attachment 272476Attachment 272477Attachment 272478

to this

Attachment 272479Attachment 272480

for $58k - and that includes the cost of the car in the first place. I did it all myself apart from the engine and paint application. More detail than you ever needed here

http://www.ddk-online.com/phpBB2/vie...p?f=28&t=33207

You'll see towards the end I detail the cost breakdown. All the comments above are valid re estimates vs. out-turn costings. As soon as the word Porsche is mentioned lots of places start adding zeros. Also these cars especially seem to be able to look really good from the outside, but once stripped all manner of sh*t happens! At least with my car it looked sh*t right from the off - although oddly the interior was complete and in amazing condition relatively.

I agree the key step is deciding whether you have the project management skills and time and patience to exercise them - finding parts, specialist suppliers and shops, etc.

Now also the outcome isn't concours, and it isn't an S - but the engine was fully rebuilt from seized (including replacement P&C's, heads, new flywheel, new clutch, new SSI's, new stainless exhaust, etc) for just under 12k$ by finding a trained Porsche tech, who I didn't know beforehand, working for a 'name' Porsche specialist who was prepared to do it in his home workshop in his spare time. As you can see in the thread he took his time and it held me up a bit in the end as he decided to move house in the middle, but for the saving the delay was worth it.

I do not need to skimp financially (thankfully) so saving $$ is not the principal objective in itself, but part of the restoration challenge for me as a ROF (Retired Old …. you fill in the rest) is to find ways to get good quality for less, while not ripping anyone off or the like. Fora like this, Pelican and DDK are invaluable. Guess what I'm saying is there is often more than one way to skin the cat…..and save a few $ on the way. If you have the time (I do) and that 'turns you on' (for me it does) then you can get a class outcome from a shitty start point for a lot less than 'cheque book restoration' costs. As another example, I negotiated a reasonable discount and free shipping from a Porsche OPC principally by asking for one! All I had to commit was a verbal assurance that I would buy at least 750$ equivalent in the coming 6 months, and not use any other OPC unless they could not supply. That meant I used Porsche parts if they were available.

Sorry if there's a bit (well ok, a lot) of chest-puffing from me here, but I am proud of what I've ended up with given what I started with, and of the overall cost to get there.

I think you guys are right to counsel caution to someone new to the potential costs of Porsche restorations, but equally I think we need to show that IF you are prepared to devote time and effort to acquire new skills and project manage then BIG savings can be made. I should perhaps add that I have minimal history in car maintenance or restoration before retirement 6 years ago. I spent my career as an operations manager/industry exec, behind a desk most of the time. I did enrol in MIG/TIG welding and sheet metal fabrication classes at my local college.

My top tip. Get a car that has never been 'restored' before and is as complete as possible, no matter how tatty or rusty. Undoing someone else's bodge, and seeking those seemingly 'minor' (but expensive) missing bits can really escalate costs. On the car above I spent days and days on sheet metalwork where the raw material cost was pennies (bits of sheet metal), and my time was free. Even if you replace sections with OE panels you are normally talking $hundreds for the parts . . .

[mwagner10702]

You will probably spend $5k in tools alone.

[tfiv]

Harvest the organs

[fromage]

new Porsche cost about 20 times more than they did in 1970...

parts are at current market prices, not 1970, it doesn't matter if for current car or 1970 and 1970 parts may demand a larger premium

there is a reason the well sorted / well maintained early cars bring big money... parts are expensive... buyers are well aware

$5000 budget is pure folly for your project car

heed prior advice, forget rescuing your project, sell it or part it out to recover what you can... you may even come out ahead... parts are expensive, make a list of what you can get it will give you an idea of reality for part cost

as has been mentioned before, get a car that only needs "TLC" and no parts... "TLC" is the only expense that you control

[boxster03]

make it a 15 year project - do it all yourself - make a home made sandblaster - take some bodyshop classes - paint it yourself - take it all apart - learn to sew and do the interior repair - rebuild the engine

will be a fun project

good luck and take some pictures