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Thread: BaT Case Study

  1. #21
    Porsche wrench/life coach Frank Beck's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bill Simmeth View Post
    What's the scoop on the cars that get the larger pictures on their site? Does the seller pay extra for that or is that an 'editorial' decision?
    Bill,

    I believe it's up to the BaT rep. ("Auction manager" as they are referred to.) I'm sure one can request it.

    In regard to the Reserve: Who can blame them for attempting to negotiate it down? Everyone wants a sale. In all fairness my rep tried several times to persuade me to put a reserve of 80k on my 70T so you can't accuse them of being too one-sided.

    BTW: I don't care how engaged or entertaining a seller is; if it's not what buyers want it ain't gonna bid up. I believe that's one of the main differences between typical charlatan auction houses and BaT. A bidder is much more likely to have his wits about him sitting in his underwear at home rather than strutting like a peacock in a big crowd (possibly with a camera on him) where the attention and fanfare is intoxicating. As long as buying collector cars is seen as entertainment I'm afraid we're stuck with the high profile auction companies where buyers often purchase cars that they really don't love.
    Warning! If I crap on you itís not on purpose.

    I often buy parts I think I need but find out I already own.

    "Save the whales."
    "Save the Rain Forest."
    "Save the baby humans."


    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=54DG48N4gs0

  2. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by Frank Beck View Post
    Been almost one week since my 1970 911T sold on BaT so I've had plenty of time to let this marinate.

    Conclusion?
    I personally don't think that this Thread was Op'd for the purpose tit for tat,, scratch ya face off stuff, regarding listings on the BaT.

    So,,, with no further adieu ,

    What are your feelings Guano , after your recent exposure to the Millennials and trolls on BaT ??

    Being on the outside looking in, I would love to know the inuendo's of the status of the OP topic.

    No For Sales please,,

    Soz,, Answer has already been previously posted by op
    Mark

  3. #23
    Frank,

    Having never listed a car on BaT, I'm interested in who actually writes, and is ultimately responsible for, the copy that appears in the auction listing.

    I see in the BaT T&C's that under the heading 'Seller Content' they variously state:
    'We do not claim ownership of Seller-generated content and material provided to us in connection with the Services
    (collectively ďSeller ContentĒ).


    'Company does not guarantee the truthfulness, accuracy or reliability of any Seller Content'

    Company does not guarantee the truthfulness, accuracy or reliability of any Seller Content or endorse any opinions
    expressed by you or anyone else. By submitting the Seller Content you fully and unconditionally release and forever
    discharge Company and its officers, directors, employees and agents from any and all claims, demands and damages......


    You acknowledge and agree that Company has no control
    over, and shall have no liability for any damages resulting from, the use (including, without limitation, re-publication) or
    misuse by you or any third party of any Seller Content. Company acts as a passive conduit for Seller Content and has no
    obligation to screen or monitor Seller Content.



    BaTMedia is a vehicle listing, information service and auction website that brings together Buyers and Sellers. BATMEDIA
    IS NOT AN AUTOMOBILE BROKER OR DEALER AND DOES NOT SELL, EXCHANGE, BUY, OR OFFER FOR SALE, NEGOTIATE
    OR ATTEMPT TO NEGOTIATE, A SALE OR EXCHANGE OF AN INTEREST IN ANY VEHICLE LISTED FOR SALE ON OUR SERVICE.
    BATMEDIA DOES NOT HOLD OR POSSESS TITLE FOR ANY VEHICLE LISTED FOR SALE ON OUR SERVICE.


    It seems that BaT go to quite some lengths in the small print in legally distancing themselves from the 'Seller Content' which presumably includes the representations made by the seller about the car in the listing. I wondered how you actually created the listing description for your 'T' as I believe BaT also assign someone to help sellers craft the listing.
    Looking for:

    1965 911 engine # 901617 & transmission # 101472-901/0
    and
    1971s engine 6310045 & trans 7167623

  4. #24
    No different than Gooding, RM, Mecum, BJ etc. It is standard "auction house" language. It is on the buyer to verify.

    A friend bought a car at Amelia a few years ago that wasn't exactly as described. He has a long term relationship with the auction house but admitted
    if they had wanted to play hard ball he was "screwed" (re: contract language). In this case he still wanted the car but thought a discount was in order for the non-disclosed discrepancies. All parties came to the table and an amicable settlement was made.
    "Be who you are and say what you feel because those who mind don't matter and those who matter don't mind." - Dr. Seuss

    Early S Registry #235
    rgruppe #111

  5. #25
    Porsche wrench/life coach Frank Beck's Avatar
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    Tim,
    I actually submitted 3-4 paragraphs of entertaining ad copy... they wouldn't use it. I indicated that I wanted some humor... nope. They write all of the ads which I find incredibly boring and they avoid using absolutes. (I.E: "No rust." "No collision damage." Etc.) I think it's fairly obvious lawyers are the main culprit.

    A seller could bring a colorful Mexican salad to the party but all the guests get is vanilla ice cream. I was privy to this going in so it was no surprise; one reason why I decided to do the kick as video. Gotta create buzz somehow. (Candidly when I was doing the 73S video and rowing through the gears at full song I thought how entertaining it would be if I was pulled over an issued an award for my exemplary driving skills... if you know what I mean.)

    Fortunately the comments feature allows a seller to blossom and express the true spirit of the car, its history/pedigree, and perhaps most importantly... his or her reputation and character. I think this is an amazing opportunity that's missed by short-sighted sellers.

    Oh, and as far as me disappointing people by not causing a ruckus over there? I may be a provocateur and armchair demolitions expert but I'm not going to wage a battle in a foreign land without first gaining support from the locals.
    Warning! If I crap on you itís not on purpose.

    I often buy parts I think I need but find out I already own.

    "Save the whales."
    "Save the Rain Forest."
    "Save the baby humans."


    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=54DG48N4gs0

  6. #26
    Quote Originally Posted by Frank Beck View Post
    Tim,
    They write all of the ads which I find incredibly boring and they avoid using absolutes. (I.E: "No rust." "No collision damage." Etc.) I think it's fairly obvious lawyers are the main culprit.

    Its an interesting legal point that if they do truly write the ads and they make specific claims about the car, then they are legally responsible for any misrepresentation therein, regardless of whether they subsequently try to disclaim this in their T&C's. Once an affirmation has been made, it cannot be disclaimed, even in a sales contract or Bill of Sale.

    Regards your 'Battle' analogy, have you read Sun Tzu ?
    Looking for:

    1965 911 engine # 901617 & transmission # 101472-901/0
    and
    1971s engine 6310045 & trans 7167623

  7. #27
    Porsche wrench/life coach Frank Beck's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by goodtogo View Post

    Regards your 'Battle' analogy, have you read Sun Tzu ?
    No but certainly understand the principles. One of the high points:

    "Know your enemy."
    Warning! If I crap on you itís not on purpose.

    I often buy parts I think I need but find out I already own.

    "Save the whales."
    "Save the Rain Forest."
    "Save the baby humans."


    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=54DG48N4gs0

  8. #28
    Quote Originally Posted by Frank Beck View Post
    I actually submitted 3-4 paragraphs of entertaining ad copy... they wouldn't use it. I indicated that I wanted some humor... nope. They write all of the ads which I find incredibly boring and they avoid using absolutes. (I.E: "No rust." "No collision damage." Etc.) I think it's fairly obvious lawyers are the main culprit.
    100% agree, that was my experience as well.. I wrote in some humor about italian car driving position and its effect on your DNA and that of your descendants, insisted on "no rust", but as Frank said, they rewrite it very bland. Besides, at least in my case, by the time the copy is out, you've waited 3-4 weeks so you just want the listing to go ahead... That just means more questions in the comment section that would otherwise have been answered.

    Another issue I found out later was there is not decent buyer rating. I wish you could rate your buyer for speed of payment, character, experience, *something*. At the very least see comments from previous sellers about that buyer, Ebay does this better... That would help with peace of mind of the post auction transaction. My buyer had a few Nigerian prince red flags (swooped in from nowhere, no auction questions or comments, lots of cars bought recently and crappy spelling of the brand name he purchased most) and I could have used some BaT reassurance from past transactions he did with them, got nothing (but I got the $ so case closed).

    Finally, Bat Themselves are unreachable, once your auction ends, you cease to exist - their voicemail box messages went unanswered, my email post auction equally unanswered. Again, can't argue with results, but it's not for everyone.
    Greg.
    ----------
    72 911T - 73 2002
    #1461

  9. #29
    Early S Reg #1395 LongRanger's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Frank Beck View Post
    . . . Been almost one week since my 1970 911T sold on BaT so I've had plenty of time to let this marinate.

    Conclusion?

    BaT is far and away a better place to sell a good car than here or any other place . . .



    Quote Originally Posted by Frank Beck View Post
    . . . I'm thinking a BAT regular has it. Those people are all criminals . . .



    .............................................

  10. #30
    Porsche wrench/life coach Frank Beck's Avatar
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    Rick,

    Do you moonlight for NYT?
    Warning! If I crap on you itís not on purpose.

    I often buy parts I think I need but find out I already own.

    "Save the whales."
    "Save the Rain Forest."
    "Save the baby humans."


    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=54DG48N4gs0

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