Kardex 300739

[softwindow]

Hallo VIN-experts,

I got the Kardex of Porsche 911 VIN 300739, the delivery date mentioned in the Kardex is 25th of march 65. Is this the date it was delivered in USA? Are there also lists that show the production date? I was told that it took about 2 months between production date and delivery in USA.
If there is a list of the production dates, is it possible to estimate also the production date of 300329 and 300275?

Kind regards.

Bernd

[moito]

Hallo VIN-experts,

I got the Kardex of Porsche 911 VIN 300739, the delivery date mentioned in the Kardex is 25th of march 65. Is this the date it was delivered in USA? Are there also lists that show the production date? I was told that it took about 2 months between production date and delivery in USA.
If there is a list of the production dates, is it possible to estimate also the production date of 300329 and 300275?

Kind regards.

Bernd

300266 built jan 11th 275 was not completet before this date ...but pretty likely in jan.
300329 end of 3rd week-beginning of the 4th week in jan my guess

[Bobs 67S]

Welcome Bernd.

First - the cars were not produced in number sequence, this is a very important thing to keep in mind. Some cars can be up to 100 numbers out of sequence in this period.

We know the production to the end of 1964 (232 quantity) and can estimate quantities by extrapolation for some early months into 1965 and be mindful that production was ramping up with each following month. 356's still dominated the production line.

There was a daily quantity of 6 to 9, 911's cars finished at the end of January 1965 having car numbers at about #300 400. This corresponds to the two cars you asked about and Moito has posted dates. Production thru February into March is a guess but we know cars about #301 000 were completed in April 1965.

The two dates on the Kardex are transfer of responsibility - shipping and invoice dates. An educated guess for when your car left the assembly hall would be in a three week period closer to the end of February 1965. (Number range could be up to 100 numbers off).

When you get a chance to visit the archives at Porsche request to see the "Production Build Book". Only a few owners have had the chance to view that document and for the shortest amount of time. Be sure to provide exacting proof that the car is yours and it's authenticity, including stamped numbers and photos of unique period build details.

Tobias Aichele published this photo of the "Build Book" first page in his book "Porsche 911 Forever Young".

[softwindow]

Thank you Bob and Franz.
So the left date at the Kardex is the date the car was delivered to Competition in Culver City and not the date the car left the factory?


Today an older owner of a shipment company told me that it took at least six weeks to transport the cars from Stuttgart to the Harbour, from Bremerhaven or Hamburg to California and after passing the custom Offices to the delivery place.

[Jules Dielen]

i thought that first date is when it left the plant. 'ausgeliefert am'

[softwindow]

Hallo Jules,
the translation of "ausgeliefert" is "delivered". And I think it is meant delivered to the car dealer and not the buyer. The second date "Abnahmebesch." could mean the check before the car is sold to the buyer.

[Jules Dielen]

Moin Bernd,

my Targa is the 4th '68 built (at least by the VIN) and it was 'ausgeliefert' 4 days after the summer break. It sold new in California, so unless it was flown, there is no way it made it to the USA in 4 days. I guess it's a matter of interpretation.

[tomster]

Servus Bernd,

the date stated below "ausgeliefert am" is the actual completion date at the plant. The date below "Abnahmebescheinigung" is most likely the day the car was actually handed-over to the distributor/customer.
I guess that date was noted on the Kardex by Porsche because that's when the warranty period started.

[Bobs 67S]

Tomster,
We have received a limited amount of information from the achieves giving a hard document that lists a small number of cars. Based on that factory information and owner provided kardex there are multiple examples of both "Build Book" dates that have been checked to the "Ausgel. am" dates. None of them are the same.

As an example there are two cars that were sold in Germany
Build Date, 2 Nov 1964 - Ausgel. am date, 26.11.64 (26 Nov.)
Build Date, 1 Dec 1964 - Ausgel. am date, 16.12.64 (16 Dec.)


We have had 70 years of Porsche production and we are still finding things that can be seen with fresh eyes, and old myths to be put to rest.


Ausgel.am was important in the transfer of responsibility and payment due for the item. The other date was when the warranty started. Both critical to Porsche and it's dealers.

The date when it left the factory - not so important. 50+ years later we place great importance on that mostly unknown fact.

What a fun hobby.

[tomster]

Bob,

after having given it a second thought I totally agree with you (or the data from your books). "Ausgeliefert am" would technically mean that the car has left Porsches premises in terms of responsibility and has most probably already been paid for by the distributor. The actual build date has been days or even weeks before that.
The term "Abnahmebescheinigung" is solely for warranty purposes and would define the day the car has been sold/ registered to/with a customer by the respective distributor.
Depending on where in the world the car has been sent to the date-delta could easily be months.
You can find numerous Kardex' that not only show an entry for that date but even more so the end of the warranty period (e.g. exactly 6 months later from that day).

From my memory I recall that I found the order sheet of my dad's first 911 between christmas and new year's eve in 1964 in some dusty file drawer. The car was due delivery just 2-3 weeks after order date. OK, transporting a car from Stuttgart to Munich is not even a 200km'ish ride...
Only the fact that Porsche was rumoured to offer a sun-roof option (which my dad then opted for) caused delivery having been postponed somewhere to July 1965. I don't have Kardex info on that car but I would bet that the dates "Ausgeliefert am" and "Abnahmebescheinigung" are just days off.

But then again, why should we care about the specific date our cars have their actual birthdays? Especially since - at least over here in GER - the date that counts is when it was first registered anyway.
No matter if that date is even technically possible...
Like in my case:
Porsche does not have any record on the "Ausgeliefert am"/"Abnahmebescheinigung"/ delivery dates of my 2.2S MY70 US-delivery car. A Kardex does not exist.
We all agree that MY 70 would run from Sep 1969 - July 1970. But all former registration slips I have at hand show Jan 1st, 1969 as date of first immatriculation. That is the more so curious since the 2.2S has not been homologated with German department of transportation before September 1969 and I doubt that it has been homologated earlier anywhere else in the world...
Should I bother? Nope.