4 point harnesses for early 911's

[LKreg]

What type of four point harnesses were used on early 911's? Were harnesses installed by the factory, dealers, or owners themselves.? And when did rules first appear concerning how old a harness could be before it had to be replaced with a new one? What is the history of Repa and Autoflug?

Thank you,

Leon Kreger

[Flunder]

Hello Leon,

The earliest "Y" harnesses used by the factory all seem to have been manufactured by Britax. However, these early harnesses are seen not only with the Britax label sewn onto the 2" shoulder straps but also occasionally with the RePa logos, apparently sewn on by Britax under contract (or perhaps dummied?).

These early style "Y" harnesses seem to have been installed in the 1968 911 T/R. I am looking forward to seeing if the harness in the Bantam's Out of Africa T/R survived.

The next version of the factory RePa harnesses was first seen in cars built as STs, including Rally and Circuit racers. This pattern combines a 2" shouder harness that has a single rear mount, although not strictly speaking a "Y" harness, with the lap belt. These shoulder straps simply loop around the standard 2" RePa lap belt and are not sewn in place.

The RePa tags for the ST pattern harnesses were sewn on the shoulder straps and the webbing employed for the belts was of the "orange thread" variety used by the factory to identify belts sewn for the European market (US spec webbing is all black).

I have seen these same ST style RePa harnesses in Carrera 2,8L competition type (RSR) and just recently saw the same spec belts in a MY74 Carrera RS 3.0 here in Connecticut.

The RSR 3,0 used a three inch set of competition belts made by RePa.

I am not familiar with the Autoflug products.

First image: Britax manufactured "Y" harness with RePa tags for 911 T/R
Second image: RePa manufactured 2" ST pattern harness with RePa tags and orange thread webbing
Third image: detail to show "orange thread" webbing and typical RePa date tags - these show 1970

[Bantam]

Tom - unfortunately the harnesses did not survive on the "Out of Africa" T/R. The three securing points are intact (one on the rear shelf, one down by the foot of the roll bar and one just above the centre tunnel on the up part before the rear seat base). I have managed to obtain a matching pair of very good condition period 3 point Britax harnesses although they have had the "Britax" tags removed from the shoulder belts (think I actually prefer the low key look!). Anyone looking should try UK ebay but search under Britax/MG/Escort etc rather than Porsche!

From my research to date I would agree that pre '70 approx Britax was the Porsche 3 point belt of choice (don't know why a UK make was used?) before Repa/Autoflug were adopted. I didn't know that Britax applied Repa logo patches to their products, you live and learn!

Tim

[letsrollbabe]

Hello Leon,

The earliest "Y" harnesses used by the factory all seem to have been manufactured by Britax. However, these early harnesses are seen not only with the Britax label sewn onto the 2" shoulder straps but also with the RePa logos, apparently sewn on by Britax to order.

These early style "Y" harnesses seem to have been installed in the 1968 911 T/R. I am looking forward to seeing if the harness in the Bantam's Out of Africa T/R survived.

The next version of the factory RePa harnesses were first seen in cars built as STs, including Rally and Circuit racers. This pattern combines a 2" shouder harness that has a single rear mount, although not strictly speaking a "Y" harness, with the lap belt. These shoulder straps simply loop around the standard 2" RePa lap belt and are not sewn in place.

The RePa tags for the ST pattern harnesses were sewn on the shoulder straps and the webbing employed for the belts was of the "orange stripe" variety used by the factory to identify belts sewn for the European market (US spec webbing is all black).

I have seen these same ST style RePa harnesses in Carrera 2,8L competition type (RSR) and just recently saw the same spec belts in a MY74 Carrera RS 3.0 here in Connecticut.

The RSR 3,0 used a three inch set of competition belts made by RePa.

I am not familiar with the Autoflug products.

First image: Britax manufactured "Y" harness with RePa tags for 911 T/R
Second image: RePa manufactured 2" ST pattern harness with RePa tags and orange thread webbing
Third image: detail to show "orange thread" webbing and typical RePa date tags - these show 1970

Tom:

When and for which cars were the ratcheting rollers used?

[LKreg]

Thanks for the info. Glad to finally know the significance of that orange stripe. I assume the blue stripe on the Autoflug has a similar purpose.

[911scfanatic]

any pics of autoflugs installed in a SWB, showing attachment points?

[Flunder]

Tom:

When and for which cars were the ratcheting rollers used?

Hi Gib:

Some say that these rollers - Autoflug aren't they - were sometimes used on MY73 RS.

Perhaps someone can post a period image of such an installation.

Sorry to say, I know nothing about the Autoflug products except that that the company made a good looking harness as shown in Leon's post.

Attached pic shows the RePa ST pattern harness used in ST, RSR and RS 3,0. You can see the orange thread running along the webbing.
Note how the shoulder straps just loop over the lap belts. These were non-conforming for SCCA tech inspection so not often seen stateside.

[Jim Garfield]

any pics of autoflugs installed in a SWB, showing attachment points?

Here is one mounting solution, not sure that it's a swb though.

[Flunder]

Hi Jim;

Looks like lightweight carpet, peanut headrest in grained leatherette on what looks like an RS lightweight seat - Jim is that roller set up in an RS?

[Jim Garfield]

You're right Tom, it probably is. I took it at RRIII and don't remember the car...