Porsche Parade Concours

[jaudette3]

I'm interested in attending the 2011 PCA Parade because it's being held in Savannah, an area my wife and I have always wanted to visit. If I go, I would most likely be interesting in entering a car in the concours event. I should have at least a couple to choose from: a freshly restored '68 911L Tangerine SWT and my '67 rally build. The SWT will be what I refer to as a showroom car, meaning it will be just as it was when it first appeared in the dealers showroom in 1968 (except probably a little better). So it will be absolutely authentic.

My rally car is far from how it was when it first appeared in the dealers showroom. As many know, it has been heavily modified into a factory spec rally car. I believe it is every bit as authentic as a showroom restoration, as I have used original (and mostly NOS) Porsche parts and period parts used for the Porsche rally builds and have followed the 1968 publication. It has been a far more challenging project than simply doing a showroom restoration as many of the parts are quite rare. However, it appears to be a bit of an oddball when it comes to shows, as there is no class that is really appropriate.

I prefer to show the rally car if I go to the 2011 Parade, but I can't find a class that it fits in where I would actually be competitive. Ideas?

Thanks,
JohnA

[cscrogham]

I'm interested in attending the 2011 PCA Parade because it's being held in Savannah, an area my wife and I have always wanted to visit. If I go, I would most likely be interesting in entering a car in the concours event. I should have at least a couple to choose from: a freshly restored '68 911L Tangerine SWT and my '67 rally build. The SWT will be what I refer to as a showroom car, meaning it will be just as it was when it first appeared in the dealers showroom in 1968 (except probably a little better). So it will be absolutely authentic.

My rally car is far from how it was when it first appeared in the dealers showroom. As many know, it has been heavily modified into a factory spec rally car. I believe it is every bit as authentic as a showroom restoration, as I have used original (and mostly NOS) Porsche parts and period parts used for the Porsche rally builds and have followed the 1968 publication. It has been a far more challenging project than simply doing a showroom restoration as many of the parts are quite rare. However, it appears to be a bit of an oddball when it comes to shows, as there is no class that is really appropriate.

I prefer to show the rally car if I go to the 2011 Parade, but I can't find a class that it fits in where I would actually be competitive. Ideas?

Thanks,
JohnA

Hi John,
If you enter the Rally car, put it in the Performance Group, probably the Street Modified class depending on the level of "upgrades.". The L would go into the Restoration Group, early 911 class. They both fit well, download the PCR's from the Parade website for detailed info.
Note that the Restoration Group judges for originality and cleanliness, the Performance Group only judges for cleanliness. Your Rally car will fit into the Performance Group better than the car that won this year, the owners knew they couldn't win in the Restoration Group with their early 911, so they managed to enter it in the Performance Group saying it had optional swaybars and won (easier to win there), and no one protested the change. That was not a good end result in my opinion, kind of like cheating to get a trophy, but your car will fit perfectly there as my 911R replica did in '08.
Since the current rules do not require a cardex, you also have the option to put the rally car in the Restoration Group, early 911 class. FYI there were no full Concours entries in the early 911 class in that group this year, but its hard to beat the 356's for the higher awards while you have a decent shot to win the whole Performance Group with a nice car.
Hope that helps...
Cole

[jaudette3]

If you enter the Rally car, put it in the Performance Group, probably the Street Modified class depending on the level of "upgrades.". Note that the Performance Group only judges for cleanliness.

Cole...

Thanks for the input. It seems like a shame to put so many hours into trying to build an authentic "factory build" rally car and then be judged only on how clean it is with no regard to authenticity. I enjoy detailing to a point, but cleaning is one of the less interesting aspects of showing a car. But it looks like Porsche doesn't have a category that combines cleanliness and authenticity other than for cars that are just as they came out of the showroom.

I once restored a 1960 Super 90 Roadster to a top of the world level using absolutely *no* reproduction parts - all original NOS or refurbished. Took eight years to complete it. I guess that would be the perfect PCA show car. And of course I never showed it. I seem to be a little out of sync with the show scene.

Cheers,
JohnA

[cscrogham]

Cole...

Thanks for the input. It seems like a shame to put so many hours into trying to build an authentic "factory build" rally car and then be judged only on how clean it is with no regard to authenticity. I enjoy detailing to a point, but cleaning is one of the less interesting aspects of showing a car. But it looks like Porsche doesn't have a category that combines cleanliness and authenticity other than for cars that are just as they came out of the showroom.

I once restored a 1960 Super 90 Roadster to a top of the world level using absolutely *no* reproduction parts - all original NOS or refurbished. Took eight years to complete it. I guess that would be the perfect PCA show car. And of course I never showed it. I seem to be a little out of sync with the show scene.

Cheers,
JohnA

John,
It will be judged for both cleanliness and originality in the Restoration Group, I was just commenting that it might actually place better in the Performance Group. There is no cardex requirement in either so you don't have to confirm the options as long as they are period correct, so there is a place for that car, I was just jumping ahead thinking of the best opportunity. I used to get paid a lot to read the rules and know the best place to compete for wins, I guess that is hard to forget...
The only group that requires a cardex is the Preservation Group, which is not the place for the rally car, as it is really designed for original paint and option type cars. The last group is the Preparation Group for new cars. So, there is a place to compete regardless, you just have to pick where you want to be based on personal preference.
Confused yet?
Cole

[fryardds]

Your Rally car will fit into the Performance Group better than the car that won this year, the owners knew they couldn't win in the Restoration Group with their early 911, so they managed to enter it in the Performance Group saying it had optional swaybars and won (easier to win there), and no one protested the change. That was not a good end result in my opinion, kind of like cheating to get a trophy,

Hi Cole,

I was interested to read your explanation of the judging for the Performance Group. I saw that car from the Road Scholars and couldn't figure out why it was in that group to begin with and why it won. Now it makes more sense and does seem as though they gamed the system.

BTW, you and your dad have a beautiful new location in Waynesboro. You're dad gave a few us a tour and pulled out some cool, B & W photos from the Holbert collection and told some stories to go along with the photos. Very fun.

[cscrogham]

Hi Cole,

I was interested to read your explanation of the judging for the Performance Group. I saw that car from the Road Scholars and couldn't figure out why it was in that group to begin with and why it won. Now it makes more sense and does seem as though they gamed the system.

BTW, you and your dad have a beautiful new location in Waynesboro. You're dad gave a few us a tour and pulled out some cool, B & W photos from the Holbert collection and told some stories to go along with the photos. Very fun.

Thanks for the note...glad you got to see the place. You notice that I didn't mention any names re: that Concours deal, but I had a poor opinion of that. When I asked, one of the principles told me that he learned how to do that from my car in 2008...