Originally Posted by varunan123
The car was entered at the 2009 Keystone, Colorado PCA Parade Concours d’Elegance in the early 911 Touring class and won first place with a score of 233.2 out of a possible 235.0, a total point loss of only 1.8 points and only .1 of a point was deducted for originality issues.
.1 deducted for originality issues...........
Last edited by Macroni; 02-01-2011 at 08:02 AM.
86 Sport Purpose Carrera "O4"
What is original? Over the past 30 years, or so, I have seen and judged, hundreds of restored Porsches, mostly 356’s but many 911’s as well. Also, I have personally restored about fifteen of these same models, four to Best of Show standards at national concours events. I can state inequitably that absolutely NONE of these was restored to “original condition”. It is virtually impossible to recreate an original master piece, I don’t care who the restorer is, including Tim Goodrich, the best Porsche restorer of all time.
As an example, the underside of the engine, wheel wells and suspension on most all 356’s and early 911’s were sprayed with cosmolene at the factory. Has anyone ever seen this reapplied on a restored car, ever? I suspect not. Further, much of the hardware on 356’s was bare steel, which over the years rusted badly. Today the solution is to re-plate with black oxide, which looks beautiful but is incorrect. The chrome plating on restored cars is much better than the original factory plating. Almost every replacement part sold by the many vendors is incorrect in one way or another. I can continue ad nauseous, I think you get the picture.
The question then becomes when is “originality” lost in the restoration process? At what point does the restored car become a turd which is criticized as not original? Where is the line drawn between making the car as original as possible and over the top modified? Is it okay to change the interior colors or material, just a little? If a sun roof is welded-in is that going too far? What about changing the exterior color or the use base coat/clear coat paint? What self appointed expert can state what, or should, be done in the restoration process and how that effects the value of the end product. Of course, these are rhetorical questions which can never be answered, not $hit-hot or anyone else. What the owner does to his car is his own business and preference. There is no such thing as a restored car to original condition. It is only original once and that was when it left the factory.
Regardless....a speaker grill is a "no-brainer" ....
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Curt Autenrieth
S Registry # 152
Porsches:
1.6L 2.7L
1.8L 3.0L
2.0L 3.2L
2.2L 3.4L h20 cooled
2.4L 3.6L air & h20 cooled
3.8L
Curt, I assume you are refering to the speaker grill in the 69S. As a matter of fact I used the original grill in the car and I have ever reason to believe that it was correct. Unfortunately, it does not fit as presicely and it could have because the dash was recovered and the material was not as thin as the original, thus making the grill protrude upward slightly. If you have other comments about the grill please let me know.
Sorry...got mixed up on threads. It was the 69E that was supposedly owiginal and had the wrong speakergrill. please accept my humble apology
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Curt Autenrieth
S Registry # 152
Porsches:
1.6L 2.7L
1.8L 3.0L
2.0L 3.2L
2.2L 3.4L h20 cooled
2.4L 3.6L air & h20 cooled
3.8L
I think the originality argument can be very complex. At the aforementioned Collier seminar, there was discussion about an engine part on a 1928 Mercedes SSK. The original part was missing, so Mercedes Restoration remanufactured the part using the ORIGINAL tooling. It was deemed incorrect because the metallurgy was different! At some point, the difference between an object of art and a mechanically reproduced item should be taken into consideration. That said, at the Scottsdale auctions, there were two MB 300SLs which are relevant. At Gooding, there was a 1962 Roadster with 7,000 miles and it was entirely original, down to the stickers, chaulk marks, tires, etc. Every 300SL expert was all over it, photographing every detail and in rapture at its originality (interestingly, like other 300SLs shipped to America toward the end of the model run, it was shipped in primer, and various colors of paint were supplied by the factory so that delivery in the buyer's choice of color could be expedited. The cars were painted by Studebaker in the US. This car had overspray in the engine compartment). This car sold at abour $850-$900k if memory serves - a record for a Roadster. At RM, there was a 300 SL Gullwing, nicely and completely restored, a solid $650k car. The bidding stalled at about $700k, and then two telephone bidders, one from China, the other from Dubai I think, bid the car to hammer price of $1.25M or $1.375M with premium. The Gullwing price was understood by many present as an anomaly and hardly market correct. The Roadster was thought well bought (but then, what do you do with it?)
356 Reg #16227
Early S Reg #700
R Gruppe #340
The guy didn't do his homework then. A little time Googling this car would have told you that.
The 68L is available from Gooding for $165k! Contact David Brynan.
356 Reg #16227
Early S Reg #700
R Gruppe #340
Living Room.....
86 Sport Purpose Carrera "O4"
As far as disclosing the sun roof additon to the 69 S, please note my description wherein this is mentioned twice. The seller decided not to mention this in the Gooding catalog description.
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