More 'other' Nürburgring badges here . . .Originally Posted by Chuck Miller
http://www.early911sregistry.org/for...ng-Badges-.-.-.
Rick
More 'other' Nürburgring badges here . . .
http://www.early911sregistry.org/for...ng-Badges-.-.-.
Rick
Wrote that it's sorta unfair to call the lesser-vintage badges repros ( --- I'm going with 'versions' --- ) . . . and here's why.
Notice . .
1) . . . clear/consistent lettering on the front
2) . . . deco 'G's
3) . . . smooth back
4) . . . Donner stamp
Purchased track-side . . . .
1993
http://forums.pelicanparts.com/5422090-post1.html
How tough would it be to date something like this? . . . Donners have been around since before WW2!
Rick
Last edited by LongRanger; 08-16-2011 at 06:46 PM.
. . . from Pelican . . .
1963
http://forums.pelicanparts.com/porsc...em-ebay-2.html
Not a great picture. And can't see the back. Comments are more bona fide than bullet-proof, but . . . compare this image to the ones above.
Without paperwork/photo evidence/death-bed testimony (maybe)--- how would you ever date these things? . . .
Rick
Last edited by LongRanger; 07-28-2011 at 06:16 PM.
Goin' German on you, Guys . . . it's not one word.
On the badge --- it's always been two.
Seen a lot of Nürburg-Ring badges in the last couple weeks --- put together my trying-to-be-short summary of the how I think the badge has looked over time, starting with the most recent iteration, noting some of the things that I see, differences, etc . . .
Licensed Merchandiser (current = 2011) --- 1st pic ---
Haven’t seen the back of this one (have now --- similar to Lesser-vintage Not-Donner --- see post #13), but I’m OK using this as an example of what any badge being produced today should look like. All the signal features are present, executed to a good standard ---- smooth quality enamel finish, bright silver metal (not polished/chromed), every surface flush
Things I notice . . . .
a) the thickness of the metal around the ‘hills’ --- looks heavier
b) the length and thickness of the ‘rays’ --- #9 is short, >#12 look uneven/funky
c) the shape of the mounting tabs --- no shoulder, almost completely flaired into the rim
Overall: nice bit, serviceable, looks the part . . . shiny/new
Vintage badges ---- Lesser- and Older- (1993 to 1963 to ?)
On all (clarification: large-size) Nürburg-Ring badges that I’ve come across, the only Maker’s name I’ve ever seen belongs to Adam Donner GmbH. So . . . 'till someone shows me otherwise, I believe Donner is/was the only outfit that’s ever produced this badge officially --- and may still be doing so, today . . .
Classic Donner --- 2nd, 3rd, and 5th ---
The Standard. Smooth, glossy black/white/green enamel, dull silver metal, smooth back, ‘A. Donner Wuppertal’ stamped on the back, in the 'wing.' Maybe some slight variability in execution over time, although pre-war examples may be stamped only ‘ges.gesch,’ otherwise difficult to date without documentation or photographs. . . but would it matter? Essentially un-changed from the 1930s’ until at least the early 90s/today . . . remarkable. This is the bit that I first saw, and have since come to recognize as the Nürburg-Ring badge.
Things I notice . . . .
a) smooth/flush (like above)
b) shouldered tabs (like below)
c) dull silver
d) Donner stamp --- Donner stamp --- Donner stamp
Overall: This is The Standard. Tens-upon-tens of thousands made . . . over at least six decades. Patinate to taste.
Specials --- 4th ---
Bring up a standard --- and a non-standard turns up. An odd-ball that I first saw, along with another ‘standard’ Nürburg-Ring badge, way back in the early 90s. And look at this thing! ---- an added ‘wreath,’ applied DMV and FIM charms, event lettering with a specific year, all finished-off with gold ---- not silver. May be for a motorcycle event . . . and no Maker’s mark visible --- but who cares. Try finding another.
Things I notice . . . .
a) wreath, combined with detailed DMV and FIM badges, on an added section
b) all lettering very thin/even/flush --- almost looks printed
c) square-shouldered mounting tabs --- compare these to latest version, way above
d) whole badge looks flat --- not convex --- in this view
e) gold!
Overall: Elvis Presley dresses the Loch Ness Monster
Rick
Last edited by LongRanger; 08-16-2011 at 06:49 PM.
Daddy
The badge that started it all . . . for me, and --- I believe --- for every badge here.
Came across this one on a German Seller’s web-site, took one look at, noted the citation on the back (among other things), thought about it for, like, maybe, a second? ---- snagged it. Trying to remember all the ones I’d seen over the years, then looking at all the other examples and images on the web . . . never seen anything like it. Never heard of anything like it.
Put the image up on our Early 911S Registry site, made some observations, solicited comments, got a response from Mark Morrissey . . . about the font of the letter ‘G.’
Now, the lettering on the face of every badge that I’ve seen has a rather stylized font that I liken to art-deco --- call it as much --- the G in particular consisting of just two lines --- the first, a single arc forming the body, with a second, short vertical pip at the bottom --- whip-zip-G.
Not mine. These ‘G’s are 4-part --- flat top, side, bottom, pip, connected by tight curves. Wasn’t sure how to date it, where it fit into a sequence . . . really bugging me . . . until I saw some old newspaper images . . .
Looking at these, two things struck me.
The first one --- immediately --- was a date . . . 1931. The track only opened in 1927. And four years later ---- here’s the image that I recognize. Shape, composition, orientation, colors --- everything. There it is. Standard's set.
The second thing . . . took a little more time.
Look at the newspaper image, from 1931.
Now look at the badge . . . from 1963.
Or 1965.
Or 1993.
Or today.
Now look at the Gs.
Same.
All deco Gs.
Nothing changed.
Every Nürburg-Ring badge done since 1931 has that same two-arc G . . . even if I couldn’t be sure if it was ‘real’ or not.
Yet mine are 4-arc
And on the back? . . . a citation . . .
Entwurf = design
Ausgeführt = carried-out
Designer and Maker.
You know what I think?
The reason my badge doesn’t fit into the sequence is because it isn’t in the sequence.
And I think that's because it dates to before the sequence even started ---- older than all of them . . .
Daddy.
Things I notice (now) . . .
1) Morrissey’s G
2) citation on the back
3) thin tabs, scribed reliefs
4) mellow tone to the metal --- below dull
Overall: ‘You gonna put that thing where?’
(--- Don't! . . .)
Rick
Last edited by LongRanger; 08-04-2011 at 06:52 PM.
I'm not using the 're-pro' word . . . . instead? --- version.
Adam Donner GmbH, Wuppertal has been producing Nürburg-Ring badges since the 1930s --- and, as I’ve said, I believe that they were/are the only official producer . . . but that's just my take. Also, because of their long tenure, I consider Donner badges to be The Standard. Doesn't mean everything else is bad, just . . . not-Donner (not 'stamped'). So, here's a summary, etc . . .
Current
From Classico . . .
http://www.classicowheels.com/specialtyparts.htm
Things I notice . . .
a) Bright polished, almost chromey finish to the exposed metal
b) heavily-textured back
c) proper convex shape
d) shallow (not flush?), kinda thin-looking enamel --- almost looks painted (cloisonné is fired on, substantial --- not just painted)
Overall: shiney-shiney/new-new bit that goes great on a shiney-shiney/new-new car
Rick
Last edited by LongRanger; 08-16-2011 at 06:52 PM.
Lesser-vintage Not Donner #1 --- pics 1 and 2 ---
Source/maker unknown --- eBay purchase circa ~2000?
Things I notice
a) dull-silver finish, nice
b) good-quality enamel
c) smooth back, but . . .
d) . . . odd identification
Overall: Nice . . . for a not-Donner
Lesser-vintage Not-Donner #2 --- pics 3, 4 and 5 ---
Source/maker unknown, date unknown
Things I notice
a) dull-silver finish, with traces of gold
b) good-quality enamel . . .
c) . . . but uneven lettering
d) finely textured back with deftly finished rim, tabs--- unique
Badge is clear-coated, with a gold finish wearing away to silver underneath. (Hmm.) Texture on the back is unique, no maker's mark, '36' stamped into a smoother square, edge is actually finished better than any Donner I've seen
Overall: Different version, unique --- just, again . . . not-Donner
Last edited by LongRanger; 08-16-2011 at 06:56 PM.
I'm identifying 4 specific types of classic LARGE Nürburg-Ring badges . . .
Not-Donners
Any badge that IS NOT stamped 'Donner' in some fashion on the back
I believe these are recent versions --- '90s? to today --- still being made by a variety of unknown sources
Donners
Any badge that IS stamped 'Donner'
I believe these are genuine Donner badges produced from the 1930s to at least '93 --- possibly later --- possibly still?
Pre-War Donners
Any badge stamped 'ges.gesch'
I believe these are genuine Donner badges produced before WW2
Kollbach-Donners
Any badge that has a citation mentioning Karl Kollbach jr
I believe these are Donner's first version of the badge, and were made before 1931
That should keep things simple.
And I also hope this'll make it easier/funner to look for --- maybe find --- this special bit.
Rick
PS And if you find one ---- put it up HERE! Good hunting.
Last edited by LongRanger; 08-05-2011 at 03:27 PM.
not the 'Ring, but Adam Donner Elberfeld 1932
Last edited by typ901; 08-05-2011 at 02:16 PM.
A Donner Wuppertal
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