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Thread: My 904 replica build thread ...

  1. #11
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    Was wondering what you're up to!

  2. #12
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    Really! I have been wondering what you were up to also. Very cool project Andy.

    Will you have it done this summer?
    Brian

    '71T
    R Gruppe #299

  3. #13
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    Brian - it's been a slow process but I'm hoping it will be on the road later this summer.


    Although I had managed to track down (& tick off) some of the items on my 'wanted' list the number of parts I was still looking for seemed to grow & grow ...

    I'd found a nice Les Leston wheel:





    - the Porsche badge in the centre isn't correct & was only added for the photos ... I'm on the look-out for an original 356A horn push (ideally with some 'patina') if anyone has one surplus to their needs.

    & was quite 'chuffed' to have discovered the origins of the 904/906/908 washer/wiper switch & purchased one at a much more attractive price than the 750 euros being asked by Marco Marinello at Elevenparts in Switzterland !



    An excellent pair of suitable used Hella foglamps were procured in Germany (Porsche used a few different models of Hella foglamp on the original cars) which necessitated Barrie modifying the lamp openings on the front of the bodywork as the car from which he took the moulds used the slightly smaller Hella 128's :







    The next 'saga' concerns the hunt for wheels ...
    Andy

    Early 911S Reg #753
    R Gruppe #105

  4. #14
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    Now to the saga of the wheels ...

    As mentioned in one of my earlier posts, the original 904's were equipped with steel/alloy wheels - 5 x 15" as std (although other sizes subsequently became avaialable).

    These were made by taking a Kronprinz (KpZ) steel centre & rivetting it into an aluminium rim. This significantly reduced the unsprung weight at each corner but Porsche didn't want their racing competitors to know about this modification so they had the wheels painted in the standard wheel silver so that, to the casual observer, they looked like std production steel wheels.

    Original wheels still surface from time to time (usually as single wheels) - indeed I managed to find a set of 4 some years ago & so had the opportunity to study them at close quarters, but I sold them to an owner of a Factory 904 that had 'lost' its original wheels over the years.








    During the early stages of my search, some reproduction steel/alloy wheels came onto the market via Karmann Konnection but something didn't look quite right about them ... & then there was the price !

    Over a period of 12 months or so I made hundreds of enquiries worldwide ...

    - Kronprinz in Germany weren't interested in digging out the appropriate dies, stamping a batch of new steel centres or selling any to me

    - every wheel manufacturer in the UK & Europe that I contacted declined interest

    - only 2 of the dozen or so metal spinners that I spoke to here in the UK came up with a positive response ... but machine set-up costs were totally prohibitive

    - Harvey Weidman was the only person who was enthusiastic about this wheel project & in fact had been working on a possible solution for a few years but it was a low priority for him & he couldn't foresee having anything available for a couple of years at least

    ... so I had drawn a blank on all fronts.

    Studying lots of real 904's revealed that very few of them still used original-style wheels - most ran on all-steel wheels or all-alloy copies ( like those produced by Alex Bivens in the US) painted to look like steels.

    Therefore, as an intermediate solution, I decided to source a set of suitable steel wheels.

    Since I still intended to (somehow) eventually come up with a set of steel/alloy wheels, I decided to try & find some slightly wider steel wheels - ideally 6's & 7's.

    Putting out some more 'feelers' I managed to find a pair of 6's in Germany & a set of (4) 7's in the US, so after arrival I had them media-blasted & powder-coated silver/grey:







    These were then fitted with Avon CR6ZZ tyres - 185/70 x 15 (F) & 215/60 x 15 (R)


    .
    Last edited by andyjboy; 05-27-2012 at 01:08 PM.
    Andy

    Early 911S Reg #753
    R Gruppe #105

  5. #15
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    Coincidentally during this same period I was looking for a set of original magnesium Campagnolo wheels for my '59 Giulietta Sprint &, during my internet searching, I came across an advert for a set of steel/alloy Alfa SZ wheels for a very (comparitively !) reasonable asking price.

    The guy selling them was in Sicily but on further investigation these turned out to be recently fabricated wheels rather than originals ... since they comprised steel centres rivetted to aluminium rims I asked if he could get others fabricated - an affirmative response but, again, the cost was prohibitive & they were an unknown quantity being fabricated by an unknown individual ... back to the search.

    Finally, by way of contact in the US, I got to hear about someone in Australia who had been repairing & fabricating Porsche 356 Carrera/550/RSK steel/alloy wheels for many years & he agreed to make a set of wheels to my specifications !

    Since this was going to be an expensive venture, I wanted them to appear as correct as possible so I started to look for a suitable set of steel donor wheels (to provide the centres) with appropriate date stamps ... they had to be dated '64 or '65 since these were the only 2 years that the early 904 body style was produced ...

    Unfortunately over the preceding 12 months the price of original steel wheels had increased dramatically but a 'wanted' add on the Early S Registry produced a set of (4) 65-dated wheels in very good condition at a sensible price :



    - so I bought them & had them shipped directly to Australia.

    I can't say that the wheel fabrication turned out to be a smooth, trouble-free transaction - there were a number of problems along the way - but I did end up with a set of 4 steel/alloy wheels.

    After a lot of research (& measuring original cars) I decided to go for a set of 5 1/2's & 6's & here are a few shots of one of the wheels:








    - & a comparison with a std steel wheel:






    - now they just need painting so that they look like std steel wheels !!!


    .
    Last edited by andyjboy; 05-27-2012 at 01:14 PM.
    Andy

    Early 911S Reg #753
    R Gruppe #105

  6. #16
    Relaxed Rich Lambert's Avatar
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    wow...can't wait to see the finished product!
    Rich
    1966 911 #303872
    ES#1197
    RG#478

  7. #17
    Senior Member boba's Avatar
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    This is going to be good!!!
    65 356SC Dolphin Gray
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  8. #18
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    Thanks for the positive comments.

    Somebody asked me if I am basing it on a specific Factory car - it's not meant to be a replica of any particular 904 but will have 'influences' from various individual cars.

    As for the actual colour choice, the vast majority of original cars were painted silver &, although I do like some of the other colours seen on 904's (including the Ben Ponn car, Irvine Laidlaw's 'maroon' car,etc) to me the 904 is inextricably linked with the German national racing colour ... silver.

    Although the general level of fit/finish of the grp panels was good, as anyone who's familiar with fibreglass bodywork knows, it still takes a lot of work to get it to the painting stage...

    After many hours of rubbing down, filling imperfections, more rubbing down, spraying guide coats, etc it was in primer:







    - & finally the colour coats & lacqer:











    The end results were excellent.

    Eventually, some decals, racing number 'roundels' & probably an orange band across the nose & tail will be added - similar to this (later) car photograpphed by Early S member Tim Scott @ Fluid Images:

    Andy

    Early 911S Reg #753
    R Gruppe #105

  9. #19
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    The continual on-going search for parts turned up a few more items from my expanding list.

    Although, modern versions of the front orange & white Hella lamps were readily available, the original version with an in-built chrome rim as used on the 904 wasn't, but persistence yielded a NOS set:




    I'd also mananged to find an original '60's Talbot Berlin mirror in great condition:





    Whilst frequently scouring Gunnar Racing's invaluable website I came across a picture posted by Kevin Jeanette of the 904 column switches:





    I'm going to attempt to emulate this set-up by using a pair of early VW Bus indicator switches:





    I'll modify them so that they fit 'back-to-back', paint the housings black & swap the black knobs for the correct ivory version:





    With a suitable length of correct diameter steel tube it should do the trick !


    .
    Andy

    Early 911S Reg #753
    R Gruppe #105

  10. #20
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    Seats were next ...

    The original cars used very basic sparsely-padded 'seats' (I use that term loosely!) covered in a unique bluish-green (teal/turquoise ?) velour/velvet material (these originals are a bit 'dusty' !) :





    These seats aren't fixed to the car - they're located by means of some raised sections on the underside that locate in some channels in the cockpit floor (& some shallower ones on the rear bulkhead) :






    Obviously this means that the seats aren't adjustable in any way - the pedals adjust instead.

    The two seats aren't mirror images of each other - the passenger's seat is about 3/4 of the width of the driver's ! :

    Barrie supplies accurate copies of the original 'cores' (which he usually gets upholstered) but, once again, I wanted to try & replicate the originals as closely as possible ...

    I spent months scanning the internet/visiting trimmers/contacting restorers/etc & bought/blagged fabric samples from as far afield as India & USA before finding an obsolete 'end of roll' (2 metres) which looked to be a very close approximation - I was elated (it doesn't take much !).

    So, once the material had arrived, I took the seat 'cores' :







    to my trimmer along with 5 or 6 colour A4 photos showing a pair of original seats from every angle.

    I explained exactly what I wanted - in particular stressing that I didn't want any stitching going across the seat cushion or back & only wanted the thinnest of foam added if absolutely necessary ...

    After a couple of weeks, as I hadn't heard anything, I called in to see them (they're only 5 mins from where I live) & was greeted with: "Ah, i'm glad you're here - i've been having a few problems with your seats ..."

    Needless to say, the (driver's) seat they'd completed had numerous stitched seams going across the seat cushion & the back !!! :evil:

    2/3 or the material had been used up & was ruined ...
    Andy

    Early 911S Reg #753
    R Gruppe #105

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