LWB Headlights: What I Know

[jaudette3]

I feel like I'm getting my arms around SWB headlights to some extent. I posted what I belive to be accurate yesterday - http://www.early911sregistry.org/for...-Brief-Summary

Now I'm hoping to compile complete information on the LWB cars. With a nod in Jim B's direction, these don't break down exactly along SWB/LWB lines as MY68 U.S. cars changed from the original Hella sealed beam design to the Sugar Scoops (for which I still haven't been able to find an "official" name). In any event, here's a first try:

U.S. MY68-MY73
Sugar Scoops with sealed beams

RoW MY68-MY73
Bosch housing, Bosch fluted lens, tungsten bulb
- H1's standard on 911S starting with 1180026 (Coupe) and 11850065 (Targa)
- H1's offered as factory option on other models.

Question: First of all, is that information correct so far?

Question: Does anyone know how long H1's were used as standard equipment on the 911S?

Question: I think that for the RoW cars that the Euro tungsten bulb assembly morphed into H4's as standard equipment at some point. If that's correct, does anyone know when that happened?

Question: Did the factory use any other headlights during the longhood era?

Thanks for your help!

Cheers,
John

[NeunElf]

My LWB resources are limited, but PET shows the H4 units starting in 1972 (remarks = "72-").

PET doesn't show a phase-out of the dual-bulb H1 units but does show a phase out for the lenses for the H1 units (remarks = "-72").

The only other headlamp assembly shown in the 1973 PET download is the sealed beam "sugar scoop" for US-bound cars.

[LiveFromNY]

I have little to contribute (I'll defer to those much more knowledgeable than me) but I want to thank John for starting this thread. I'll look forward to reading the collective insights of the forum.

[RSTarga]

71 was still definitely H1, if someone has a 72 and 73 euro owners manual, there is a headlamp adjusting section which should cover the type of headlights used. I remember that H4's started at the end of 73. I have a 73 Euro manual, but not currently at home.

[jaudette3]

Thanks everyone - I've been curious about the LWB cars for some time and I'm sure that all will be revealed on this thread. It sounds like the U.S. cars are a piece of cake, we just have to figure out RoW.

Another question: Did French delivery cars come with yellow headlight lenses?

Cheers,
John

[NeunElf]

Thanks everyone - I've been curious about the LWB cars for some time and I'm sure that all will be revealed on this thread. It sounds like the U.S. cars are a piece of cake, we just have to figure out RoW.

Another question: Did French delivery cars come with yellow headlight lenses?

Cheers,
John

PET doers have the answer for yellow lenses.

For H1 Headlights, French cars had yellow lenses:

911.631.101.00 HEADLAMP- BOSCH -ASYMETRICAL LENS WHITE NOT FOR (USA) (F) /LL
911.631.101.01 HEADLAMP- BOSCH -ASYMETRICAL LENS YELLOW FOR (F) /LL
911.631.101.02 HEADLAMP- BOSCH -ASYMETRICAL LENS WHITE /RL

911.631.111.00 LENS WHITE FOR 911.631.101.00 /LL -72
911.631.111.01 LENS YELLOW FOR 911.631.101.01 /LL -72
911.631.111.02 LENS WHITE FOR 911.631.101.02 /RL -72


But, for H4 units, French cars had clear lenses and yellow bulbs:

911.631.102.00 HEADLAMP NOT FOR (USA) /LL
911.631.102.02 HEADLAMP /RL

999.631.202.90 HALOGEN BULB H 4 12V-60/55 W
999.631.202.91 HALOGEN BULB H 4 12V-60/55 W YELLOW FOR (F)

[jaudette3]

Haven't revisited this for a while. I thought I would try and summarize what I understand what we know to be true at this point:

U.S.

• Sugar scoops
  These sealed beam units started in 1968 and were used through 1973.

RoW

• "Euro" headlights
  These are very similar to the H4's of today with Bosch housings, Bosch lenses and Bosch reflectors using P45t incandescent bulb. The bulb could be replaced with the H4 dual filament halogen bulb with the P45t base when the bulb came out in 1972.
• H1's
  Standard on Euro 911S's through '72 or '73.
• H4's
  The first lamps that we call "H4's" (which is actually a bulb) used an H4 bulb with a P43t base and had no city lights (that one puzzles me as I thought Europe mandated city lights). These were used by the factory beginning sometime in 1972 or 1973. Starting in 1974 and moving forward H4's included city lights and the P43t halogen bulbs. The only real difference between the Euro lamps and the H4's is that the Euro's reflector is configured to accept bulbs with the P45t base while the H4's reflector accepts bulbs with the P43t base. Everything else appears to be the same.

Does that look pretty much correct?

Cheers,
John

[NeunElf]

Haven't revisited this for a while. I thought I would try and summarize what I understand what we know to be true at this point:

U.S.

• Sugar scoops
  These sealed beam units started in 1968 and were used through 1973.

Weren't these used on US-spec cars through 1989?

RoW

• "Euro" headlights
  These are very similar to the H4's of today with Bosch housings, Bosch lenses and Bosch reflectors using P45t incandescent bulb. The bulb could be replaced with the H4 dual filament halogen bulb with the P45t base when the bulb came out in 1972.
• H1's
  Standard on Euro 911S's through '72 or '73.

The early parts book ('65-'69, both hardcopy and downloaded) shows that the H1s started as standard on the non US-Spec 911S early in the 1968 model year (Coupé 1180226 and Targa 1185065). The later parts book ('70-'73) doesn't show the old euro-style headlight with the P45t bulb at all so the H1 units must have been standard for all 911s in '70 an '71.

Electronic PET shows the euro-style headlight with the P45t bulb for the 912 only and the H1 units for all 911s.

• H4's
  The first lamps that we call "H4's" (which is actually a bulb) used an H4 bulb with a P43t base and had no city lights (that one puzzles me as I thought Europe mandated city lights). These were used by the factory beginning sometime in 1972 or 1973. Starting in 1974 and moving forward H4's included city lights and the P43t halogen bulbs. The only real difference between the Euro lamps and the H4's is that the Euro's reflector is configured to accept bulbs with the P45t base while the H4's reflector accepts bulbs with the P43t base. Everything else appears to be the same.

Does that look pretty much correct?

Cheers,
John

All the parts books agree that the H4s were installed in non-US-Spec 911s from 1972 on. Wikipedia says the H4 bulb was introduced in 1971.

I've always found it very easy to tell the difference between the H4 units and the old euro-style headlight with the P45t bulb. The lens on the euro-style headlight follows the contours of the glass covers on the '67 and earlier US-spec sealed bean units (as well as all 356s and '66 and earlier VWs). The H4 units have a lens that's a bit more vertical so the lens has a sort of horizontal glass "ledge" at the top.

Here's my knowledge:

Year	Covered Sealed Beams	Sugar Scoops	Euro Tungsten P45t	H1s	H4s
1965-1967	USA 911-912		non USA 911-912
1968		USA 911-912	non USA 911-912 except 911S after Coupé 1180226 and Targa 1185065	911S after Coupé 1180226 and Targa 1185065
1969		USA 911-912	non USA 912	non USA 911
1970-1971		USA 911		non USA 911
1972-1989		USA 911, 912E			non USA 911

[Jim Breazeale]

Jim and John

"Sugar scoops" were used from YM1968 thru YM1985 in the US. YM1986 thru YM1994 used H5 headlight assys.

Regards

Jim
PS: This is from memory. I didn't read no damn book or look on a computer.

[jaudette3]

Thanks Jim and Jim. I think we've got it nailed down.

Cheers,
John

P.S. JimA: Can I use your chart on my website? With attribution of course.