Age old problem

[sithot]

"Cracked dashes ("syndrome") comes back to bite manufacturers.

http://www.gm-trucks.com/forums/topi...suit-launched/

[mrgreenjeans]

This and the level of frequency on engines with the chronic failure symptom: the v/8s with 'Cylinder deactivation mode'.
Some have literally had engines with several cylinders not firing upon delivery to dealerships. And had to get crate motors sent and installed before retail to the public !

NONE of these sort of issues are seen on such vehicles as the Tundra. Or Sequoia or Highlander or Landcruiser......

Why cannot the American public see this level of ineptitude and poor build quality and avoid such expenditures and heartache ?

Laying out 50-80 large for these upscale GM units which disintegrate before the lease or purchase price is half paid off ?

We have become a nation of idiots which 'settle' for what sells us down the river of mass marketing. What is perceived of as cool with little regard for true quality.

( Can you tell by now I don't drive any 'American' built pickups or SUVs ? Which have the majority of content produced or assembled in Mexico ? )

[sithot]

Remember that Toyota has had their ass handed to them for oil sludge problems in the V6 engines and frame rust in the Tundra. Got a picture somewhere of a 1st generation Tundra body and box siting on blocks while the dealer waiting for a replacement. Lexus got in on the sludge issue too.
Dodge RAM is assembled in Mexico. Labor costs. Test drove one with Spanish display. Dealer hadn't properly PDI'd the car. LOL.

GM's two best vehicles with regards to recalls and issues are: 1)Corvette and 2) GMC HD trucks I had coffee with a GM Technical insider a few weeks ago and asked him the question. I'm driving a 2500HD and love it. The Duramax engine is wonderful. Their particulate burn off system is far superior to Ford or RAM imho because they don't "over-fuel" the engine to complete the burn off. GM uses a 9th injector in the trap to add fuel for the "cooking". There is some question as to the longevity of the Ford valves and seats due to the high temperatures they experience in their burn-off process.


I was a Ford guy forever until they forgot how to put a good diesel engine in a truck after the 7.3 Power Stroke.

Customer service is what I look for in any dealership but it doesn't mean I'm buying a BMW, Volvo, Mercedes, Honda etc, etc. without some insight into the quirks of the vehicles. My '00 MB wagon has 168,000 on it and the wife's MB sedan has nearly 130,000 miles. Both have been good cars needing only normal maintenance.

My friends with BMW's are constantly dealing with electrical issues and overly complicated that don't need to be complicated. http://www.nytimes.com/2014/04/11/au...r-engines.html

[RSTarga]

BMW is the German Jaguar.

[uai]

I have been driving ca. 650.000 kms BMW in the past years (2x 3 years e46 320d, 1x 3 years e87 123d, 1x 1 year e91 330xd, 1x 1 year e39 525i) - no electrical problems only mechanical stuff that was normal or has been under warranty. Oh I forgot I drove about 60.000 kms old BMWs too in that time only electrical issue is battery draining on the M5.

[mrgreenjeans]

I am glad you brought up the rust issue.

If anyone knows about rust, it has to be the General. From the era of redesigned Chevrolet 1/2 and 3/4 tons in 1973, (era of the Vega) when GM found it advantageous to use recycled steel to produce vehicles of such high oxygen content, the product was virtually rolling out the factory rusting beneath the paint. Primer ? What primer ?

And this continued on thru the eighties and nineties with many variations on finishes which included nice long runs on the rocker panels sometimes hanging 1/4 to 1/2 inch below the drip edge....... wonderful stuff. A friend of mine (deceased now due to cancer induced paint residue in his body) painted NEW trucks, Suburbans and Blazers before delivery to the customer, of those which failed inspection by the dealership or customer. Over 700 complete and full paints on defective trucks. It made him a wealthy man with several employed in his shop and full 100 hour work weeks. ( to strip the paint, all he had to do was turn up the pressure on the shop tank and power wash off the paint..... it came off in small sheets ). D-A a bit of the primer and re-shoot. In n' out.

I owned several GM farm trucks over the years , both pickup and larger 2 tons and Tandems. Engines were great in most cases ( except the 454, which from new drank oil at 1 quart to 400 miles. It got better after the warranted overhaul at 10,000 miles: 1 quart to 500 miles.) I won't discuss the diesel GM 'Detroiter' which left at least a gallon overnight on the floor or ground when parked. Running or not. Thankfully, I had plenty of drip pans at the ready. My neighbor had one too and we laughed about the fact this process helped extend oil change intervals, as one always had to add at least a gallon of new oil every day of use on the farm.

But the body and interior integrity on the GM lines were no where close to those in Ford or Toyota trucks I owned. (And my Dodges are all vintage and pre-1965 , so they are from another time and place in quality entirely. One we will never most likely see again with that company now they are owned by FIAT.)

[Haasman]

Not sure this observation is exactly on topic .... but several weeks ago I stopped in to a small northern California Dodge, Jeep and Chrysler dealership for a quick service issue. I was told that they were "inundated with all the recalls and frankly were holding off on scheduling appointments for the foreseeable future .....".

I said "You are kidding, right"?

The Service manager replied "I will I was .... never in over 25 years of auto service business have I ever seen anything like this".

I asked the nature of the recalls and was told mostly electrical but "You name it and its probably on the list".

I sought service elsewhere.

[ErichW]

I had a Tundra, no big deal. I think the domestic trucks are better. In addition I have heard some horror stories about motor replacement costs on the Toyota V8's. The domestic guys have the replacement motor thing down.

[sithot]

I had a Tundra, no big deal. I think the domestic trucks are better. In addition I have heard some horror stories about motor replacement costs on the Toyota V8's. The domestic guys have the replacement motor thing down.

The "crate engine" is down to a fine science. For your edification.

http://www.gmperformancemotor.com/category/ENG.html
http://www.fordracingbyspeedshopdire...engine_s/1.htm
http://moparproshop.com/performance_engines

[sebastianroher]

I had a Tundra, no big deal. I think the domestic trucks are better. In addition I have heard some horror stories about motor replacement costs on the Toyota V8's. The domestic guys have the replacement motor thing down.

Our '05 Tacoma is one of the best vehicles I have EVER owned. I don't think I'd trade it for any truck/car made in the states. No other mid-size truck can really compare with it on terms of reliability/resale value. This truck WILL last forever with proper maintenance. I'd only trade it in on another Tacoma.

Second place goes to our Camry (my wife's first car). ZERO Issues with the engine/transmission. The only problem was a flex pipe on the exhaust that rusted out and separated which was easily remedied by grinding off rusted bolts and bolting a new unit on.

Bottom line: I love older American made vehicles (and the new Vettes), but I wouldn't touch anything coming out today with a 10 foot pole... I'll stick to my classics and for my daily drivers I'll stick to Toyota!