Carbon Fiber?

[roane3]

Have any of you considered using carbon fiber for upgrade pieces for these older hot rods and road racers? Maybe the flared rear fenders (ST style), hoods, door skins, seat frames, air boxes, front splitters and rear tails, etc. Just a thouight.

[boba]

Hi roane3, welcome to the board.

There are CF pieces available for the parts you have mentioned plus front fenders, roof panels, dashes and other bits.

The decision for most is based on cost vs weight savings over FG.

Racing use vs street use is also something to consider.

It is possible to get these cars light without the use of either FG or CF, you can get it even lighter with FG or CF. One additional advantage is the ability to move the CG lower and forward. This will help for a track car, not sure it makes economic sense for a hot rod.

The structural advantages of CF are not realized on the hang on body work so weight and 'cool factor' are what you are paying the premium for. And it can be a healthy premium.

Having said that I have used both FG and CF on my projects but mostly for the "I just want to". I have picked FG over CF for some bit just due to the cost delta. After it is painted the only way to know is if you tell people, of course you could leave it raw.

[a911s]

CF hood is not only much lighter but much stronger than FG if you are wanting to avoid buckling at speeds over 130 mph at the track. Getty makes a good one.

[37yrold911]

"It is possible to get these cars light without the use of either FG or CF"

- how?

- and how much lighter...

[Flieger]

about 2000 pounds: http://forums.pelicanparts.com/showt...=452416&page=5

Or, my car has only fiberglass panels, no interior, but has a roll cage and undercoating and stock suspension for now. It also weighs 2000 pounds. This may be easier than the other route.

[boba]

"It is possible to get these cars light without the use of either FG or CF"

- how?

- and how much lighter...

You should note that I continued that with FG and CF you can get it lighter.

I should add if this is a discussion of lightness it is also easier to get it light with the use of FG & CF.

As to how - start with complete disassembly, then strip the tub to bare metal, do any rust and or body repair & reinforce to purpose to include cage or roll bar. Then powder coat underside, trunk, engine compartment and interior - lighter and tougher than paint. Only put back on the car what you need for the type of use intended. If a track only car leave off the lights and delete the unused wiring. The interior can be left bare with lightweight race seats, forget the sound deadening and carpet. Again leave all the creature comfort stuff in the garage. There is weight to be saved in the wiring harness if you are so inclined to make a purpose harness for just what you need. If you look at John Dilger's car you will find he left off the wiper motors and assembly (how much does Rain-X weigh?).

Now if you want to go all the way with CF & FG, lexan windows, start with a CF roof, doors, lids, and fenders. Now it is getting light.

I do not have the weights at hand but we weighed an few bare tubs and there is only a slight difference from 69 thru 89, the 964's get a bit heavier. I'll look for the weights we got and post.

[Jens]

Hey Bob, I know you speak with authority about this. I would love to see the weight comparisons you got with the various bare tubs.

Speaking of powder coating. I wonder about doing the entire tub and all the panels as a finish coat. I've heard there are more and more powder coat color options every day. The toughness and durability are really appealing, and lightness is a real bonus.

[boba]

Jens,

We looked at doing that on a few builds early on. The down side is that the quality of the finish is not a high enough standard for a street car. If you ever have to do any repair it would be more labor and a harder match and blend. For a full track car that would have graphics you could consider it. If you were to use CF or FG panels those would need to be painted after the tub was powder coated and getting a perfect match and blending would be the consideration.

Back to the question of lightening, I did not mention gutting the doors and eliminating the window regulator in favor of a pull strap.

[boba]

CF hood is not only much lighter but much stronger than FG if you are wanting to avoid buckling at speeds over 130 mph at the track. Getty makes a good one.

Randy, I agree.

This is one of the choices I made for a project based on cost, Getty has 3 hoods the FG at $459, a foam core at $599, and CF at $859. I felt like the foam core would meet my needs at quite a bit less than CF.

I did go with the CF doors because I felt I would benifit from the greater structural stiffness.

Then you do spend a lot more time over 130 than I do.

[Toronto66_911]

I used a carbon fiber engine shroud on my 2.7 ,but it is almost the same weight as the plastic original. I do like the look though..