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Manu
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Hi Raj,
As we discussed on the phone, I also think that the car probably remained at the factory for a while and then was sold off to a customer at some point. We don't have a build date but it was built as an original long stroke 2.5. It follows then that it would have been built months before April '72, maybe even in late '71 given that 0495 is an early long stroke based on the '72 ST list that has been circulating, and April is late in the '72 model run. Also, what exactly does the Barth letter mean if it is taken literally... the car was "delivered to be used by the factory in April '72"? Again what was it doing before April, and was it doing something else with the factory starting in April, or was it sold off in April?
The questions yet to be answered are what did it do while a factory car? When was it sold to a customer? Who was the customer and what races (if any) did it participate in before being sold to Vasek?
Matt
Raj,
Yes I would think that 0495 would have been made much earlier than April if this car has an April production date. Thanks.
Matt
I think i got up to 911 230 0841
Glenn posted the details on 911 230 0921 earlier in the thread and also on 911 230 1195.
The next one on Raj's list that I have any details on is 911 230 0934
I have that as a Car in the USA/ Canada in 1973 with Heimrath Racing.
Here is a photo of it at Trans-Am Edmonton 19.8.1973 for Ludwig Heimrath but the first event I have it recorded as doing was in March 1973 at Trans-Am, Road Atlanta, for Heimrath Racing with Heimrath / Minter (maybe as car 74 as that seemed to be the number that team used that year)
It seems to have been sold to a Norm Ridgely for the 1974 season.
there is more information on racingsportscars.com
The next one on my list is 911 230 0987 which again has been mentioned in a few threads on this board, is owned by a board contributor, and was mentioned earlier in the thread
here are a couple of photos: the porsche paperwork has been posted before on this thread, so some period photos (the blue car #87 in the photos from the Norisring 24/6/73 ) and two, i don't think have been posted here of it today
I will let the current owner contribute more if he wishes
I believe that 911 230 1139 was a practice car for Keyser in 1973
If so, it may be the camera car shown at the Targa Florio in 1972, although it may have been the race car #23. I dont have numbers for either although one or the other was also at le mans and i think nurburgring with keyser
the camera car 23T was a different car to the race car 23 as both appear together in some photos
I think the camera car may also be the car shown that was for sale in the UK in the past couple of years
can anyone on the board shed any more light on this?
All i know about this one is from an ad when it was being sold by Edmund Harris and some snippets of information from other sources
911 230 1348 sounds like a "customer built" car - not a factory built one from the descriptions given. However as a number of people have said the competition history and lineage is as important as the origin of these cars.
this is what was on the website for the sales pitch for this car a year or two ago
"Porsche 911S chassis No 911 230 1348 was delivered, in silver, to Brumos Porsche in Jacksonville Florida in 1972. The car was supplied direct from the Factory to Peter Gregg in basic form along with all and any parts Brumos required in order to prepare the car for the 72 Imsa season. It was to be a second race car for Peter Gregg and also play it's part in future development for the 73 cars for the factory.
Also for the 1972 season, Canadian racer Jacques Bienvenue had ordered a new competition 2.5 911S (SR). Unfortunately this car could not be delivered to Bienvenue, the one destined for him was 'taken' instead by the factory to replace one of their rallye cars which had been totaled.
The Porsche Factory suggested that Bienvenue call Gregg at Brumos Porsche to arrange a deal on his second car (# 1348) - Gregg agreed and a deal was done.
Bienvenue raced the car in the remainder of the Canadian championship winning four races outright and in so taking the championship title.
In 1973 Bienvenue sold the car to fellow Canadian Marc Dancose. He repainted it black and raced the car, intially with the 2.5 motor and later fitted with a 2.8, and then 3.0 ltr in RSR specification, in the IMSA GTU series, regularly finishing in the top 5 in 73 and 74. In 1975, again with Jacques Bienvenue as co driver, winning the Canadian championship for a 2nd time.
From 75 to 77 the car then only raced periodically in IMSA and TransAm races in the USA until being put into retirement and storage. In 1980 Dancose sold the car to Michel Pilon, who in turn sold it to Jaques Rivard.
The car remained as original and unrestored in storage up until the mid 1990's when it was discovered and purchsed by well know Porsche collector and enthuisiast, Prescott Kelly. Kelly set about a complete restoration back to it's original 1972 2.5 specification and colours - from the chassis up - and carried out by Rivard.
The car was then raced throughout the USA in historic events with great success. The car was invited to compete at the '50 years of Porsche' historic meeting at monterey in 98 and both Renn Sport Reuniun meetings (2001 at Lime Rock - were the car had won twice in the early 70's !! - and in 2004 at Daytona) taking class wins at each.
A brief selection of period race results include;
1972
Mayor's Cup 1st
6hr St Croix 1st
Grand Pris Trois Rivieres 1st
3hr 'Labbats 50' endurance 1st
Winner 1972 Championship (Bienvenue)
IMSA
3 hr Bryer. 2nd in Class.
Daytona Finale. # 15 - 9th.
Camel 500klm Watkins Glen. 7th.
1973
12 hr Sebring dnf
IMSA
3hr Daytona 4th
Limerock 3rd
Limerock 3rd
3hr Indianapolis
1974
Watkins Glen 6 hr (world maufactures championship) 6th O/A.
Daytona 250ml 11th O/A
1975
Winner Canadian championship.
The car has a complete history file (verifying all of the above - including all original paperwork & hand books from Brumos Porsche, letters of confirmation from Bienvenue, Dancose, Pilon, Rivard and the Factory, many original press clippings and period photographs, original race log books - and much more), it is surely one of the most historic of all the 911 2.5 SR's. "
the photos are all from when the car was being sold
Hugh , you listed details this car earlyer but it has only just hit me the fact that this was owned by a Kiwi!! so i would like to track down more info .
Do you have any other photos of the car as below in the kiwi paintwork and do you have any ideas if Mr thackwell is still around your neck of the woods or in the racing scene still in aussie?
911 030 1715
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911 030 1715 - finally an "Australian" car
The only RHD track ST
Western Australian registration XBC 121
Nick Moss has lots of information and pictures here http://www.early911.co.uk/historic/html/1970_st.html
"The cars racing career started in 1971 when it was sold new to New Zealander Ray Thackwell.
Hi John
you looking for inspiration for your project?
I have other photos ....... but they are the ones that Nick has on his site as well - and all much more modern with none having the Kiwi on the side
This is the ONLY one I have ever seen of the car in early days in WA
it was from a newspaper article back in the day when it was in a display at the state library or museum or something. A reference to the image at the state library in WA is here . I have not tried to order it as i believe it is the same one i have but if you are looking for a good copy you might try them (the reference says there are 2 images)
Most of the pictures (and there are not many) are of Thackwell's 1973 RSR rather than the ST
He went to live in the UK in the mid / late 1970's. He was born in the early 1930's but i dont know if he is still around or not.
You might have heard of his son, Mike Thackwell (also a Kiwi born in aukland) who made into into Formula One in 1980 at the age of 19. Despite great talent he had very little experience (he had only been racing since 1979) and was unsuccessful in the three GP races he entered that year (for Arrows and Tyrell).
Through the 1980s Mike Thackwell drove for a variety of teams in F2, F3000, the World Sports Car Championship, the Japanese Protoype Championship, and the New Zealand International Championship before retiring completely from motor racing in 1988. he may be contactable.
You should contact Nick Moss in the UK. He would have seen what was around so far as history when the car was being restored and may be able to put you in touch with the owner at that stage. I remember talking to the then owner a couple of times when he was chasing historical information on the car. I am not sure what he got but I am sure you would be able to find out.
regards
Thankyou for the info , i will have a look through our pcnz data base as i'm sure there is a family of thackwells listed !They may be related .
I'll also contact the people in the mclaren trust i know and see if the have a contact.