The real 73 RSR TF Winner - Porsche Factory Scam??

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Originally Posted by varunan123

-the pix of the car with the hood lights shows black horn grilles chrome trim turn signals and rear view mirror,black trim head lights and black cibie lights -six all together limit due to fia papers.here is the photo of zazada prior to oct-tdc cars had black trim all around including side mirror.0001 and 0002 are both represented in the early pix of the document.

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Hi varunan123

It is hard to see on the scans. i tried to PDF the papers but they are too big to email let alone post.
the pics are a bit misleading on colour. On my copy they are definitely chrome mirror and light surrounds, and look like chrome horn grills but the lighting makes this unclear and they may be black horn grills.

The headlight rims and aux lights are definitely black- but are so on S AK 1337 at the Monte (see pic) and on most factory rallye cars of around that period - I suspect to reduce glare.

You can just see the edge of the 1337 number plate and the black light pod in the second photo from the TDC practice

I think we have discussed this problem with chrome v black on photos before - scanning and then reducing the photos seems to exacerbate it when they are black and while photos

another close up

the picture quality deteriorates compared to my original where i can just make out the registration plate

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Originally Posted by varunan123

Hugh you may be right about the homoligation documents in terms of SA-K1337.I was wondering if the pix of the back of 1337 at tdc, ( I assumed ) is a red car and the whitish appearance was just sunlight i don't know?-.I also know that 0001 was at the tour de corse as a practice car.Sorry for my rush to judgement.:) You are wise beyond my years master H-yoda.:DThanks for saving me from going to the dark side.

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It is hard to tell from the scans (and not that easy with the actual pictures) but the picture of the back of the car at the TDC practice does show a white roof. you can see the white bonnet and roof better on the other picture.
on the first picture the roof of the other car against the wall is also white but looks like sun glare in the scan

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Originally Posted by varunan123

I also agree about black and white photos as jim calzia and you have pointed out.I also noticed on the black and white photo you posted of 1337 there is a padlock on the front hood and there is something sticking out of the front of the homoligation documents photos.But it is not there in the color photo..

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I am not sure what that is on the front bonnet of the homologation document.
I will try to scan a hi res copy and email it to you

Another of Nr. 107:

Varunan123:

Did the picture you posted on the 73 Monterey Historic thread of the restoration project showing the Martini stripes come from Gunnar Racing? The grease pencil VIN does look to end in 002. This could clear the mystery about what happened to 002 after the Targa. But if this is now supposed to be 017, it doesn't seem to fit with the Strahle history of 002, which had 002 as an RSR prototype in red at the same time when 0017 was issued to the press dept in white paint with the positive Carrera script in July 72 according to the RS book. Why would 0017 have the positive Carrera script this late in the model year if it had been through another life as a race car? Seems the Sales Dept. would have insisted on the negative script by the summer of 73.

Gib

What would be an explanation for the 002 grease pencil number on the dash of a car that was stamped 017? The Martini stripes on the cowl along with the 002 grease pencil number would seem to tie this body to the Strahle/press car #3 and then as 107 at the TF. Another mystery it would seem.

Gib

After taking another look at that grease pencil number, it does appear it could be 1030202, which would be an early production number for 017. Another factor, since 002 was a renumbered 72 S which had a dash installed, I doubt that the factory would have pulled the dash off to pencil in another number under it. I doubt if the production numbers were restamped on the front of the lower dash area when the front boot number was redone. Varunan123, does 001 have a 72 production number (102xxxx) or 73 (103xxxx)?

We can let 0017 stay out of this thread to keep the confusion to a minimum, sorry about that.

Gib

Hi guys

I agree that 017 is not a part of this equation. However for the record this is a picture from the RS book showing it at the time of a road test. Note there are no sports seats at this stage (or in the build specs either). Also note the drilled discs. Was this to help with he spirited driving in the road tests?

As Raj noted there was a blue one as well with prototype lettering. That was RS015, which was a sport version (compared to the red one being a touring version.)

A picture of the blue one from the RS book is also attached.

There is no sign of an oil door on either.

PS I think the picture Porsche, or someone, else supplied to Gunner Racing shown above in post 439 is the car with blue graphics - 015 - as it seems like a M471 rather than a M472 from the trim on the bumpers and lack of trim under the Carrera graphics .... but we don't want to start another debate on such things here , do we? :p :)

Yes
even though it is in B&W , the car looks like the blue graphics one as it seems to be a M471 from the trim etc. Given that there were ever only supposed to be 2 of them with prototype graphics and one (RS 017) being a M472 and the other (RS105) being a M471, I think calling it as 015 is a pretty safe bet

PS
assuming that the car on the homologation papers LEO ZA 63 is RS 015 this is what its engine compartment looked like
no sign of a 72 set up there!

I was just looking at some other photos of the 73 Targa on a European site and found this!!

if you look carefully in the background of this picture of the Brescia Corse Tipo 33TT3 Alfa in the pits at the 1973 Targa you can see an "RSR" with the race number 108 in the same style as the "second" 107 and registration plates LEO ZA 60 (or it looks like 60 maybe it is an 80).

This car seems to have a "T" signifying it is a training car only and also seems to have only a conventional single exhaust signifying it does not have an RSR engine.

The Martini graphics are just visible enough to suggest they are the same treatment as the original car 107 (and the rear of car 107 in the race) - center stripe splayed out at the ends.

Car 107 had the plates LEO-ZA 68 car #9 and #8 did not have plates, as they had the small sticker on the front quarter window signifying temporary registration. I would have thought that the "proper" car 108 - R8 or whatever was intended to be the 108 race car (or maybe R8 was intended to be #107?)- would not have had registration plates either, so I don't think that this is that car.

The front and rear guards are partly visible and while they are`taken from a different angle than I am used to seeing they do look a lot like the early Strahle versions - ie less "flowing" from the top and more like an extension grafted on just to cover the wheels. The car also looks to have silver light trim, not black, but the photo is not good enough to be certain.


so what is this car? i don't think it is necessarily #108. Given it has a "T" on it it is definitely a practice car.

I have seen instances where there have been 2 cars at an event - one with the race number and another spare car with the same number but a "T" signifying a practice car for that entry. This is more common these days, but it is possible/probable that this was not car race car #108 - or was car #108 always a practice car?

If car 107 was LEO ZA 68 and this is a similar car LEO ZA 60 does that make the case for two 1972 shelled cars at the Targa in martini trim?????

is this Singer's "Mongrel"
comments.............................