For example:
http://i57.tinypic.com/4lz6p.png
PS: Typo in title, meant to say Hagerty
For example:
http://i57.tinypic.com/4lz6p.png
PS: Typo in title, meant to say Hagerty
Good cars will still bring the money. The problem is all of the bad pieces being marketed as the gold standard (BS). They do not help the rest of those who would sell with integrity and honesty.
CarFax and AutoCheck are great tools for the 17 digit VIN cars. That's what a lot of Rennlist and Pelican cars are and I've found my fair share of turds in the punchbowl. Some admitted "issues" but glossed over
the facts. Others simply left it out of the ad.
You're on your own out here. It's the Wild West.
+1 Check Hagerty's chart for #1 65's.Quote:
Originally Posted by sithot
Here...
Attachment 315476
But the 1965 911 with two two barrel carbs is extremely rare...Quote:
Originally Posted by Bill Simmeth
Interesting... they've pulled the "January" data down.
Yea I can afford to by parts again.... Been crazy lately
One month does not make a "flat lining" case for early 911's.
You will continue to see them rise month after month, year after year.
Mark my words....
;)
It's not a month, it's 4 months (September 2014-January 2015). Two data points connected by a horizontal line meet my definition of a flat line, especially after such a meteoric rise that preceded it. As for what the future holds, I know about as much as you (or Hagerty for that matter), which is defined by the null state.
The '70 T example is not reflective of the real world numbers I've seen, which are far lower. I think the difficulty here is that one or two stellar examples may have sold each of the last 3 quarters.
We all know that the eBay mix is heavily weighted toward #4 cars, but look at the '1970 Porsche 911 completed' sales.
http://www.ebay.com/sch/Cars-Trucks-...mplete=1&rt=nc
Perhaps, but for Hagerty's observation of a market flat-lining (or whatever term you wish to use) would mean that the sampling bias that you allege was contained in earlier periods is no longer present, and the results therefore can be ignored on the basis that previous biased numbers are now being compared with non-biased numbers, which is the essence of what you are saying.
Keep in mind, Hagerty does separate their values based on a 4 scale rating. Not sure how they determine which cars fall into which categories on a sale by sale basis, but that categorization of sales results does mean they avoid lumping basket cases in with trailer queens.
Most all the current Hagerty valuation charts time out at August 2014, so it's a bit unusual to see them predicting the future per post #1.
Yes, but as Bill Simmeth's post #5 stated:
"Interesting... they've pulled the "January" data down."
I just checked myself, and that's true for the graph I posed in #1, which if you visit their site today it only has data to September 2014. Obviously someone released the data when they weren't supposed to.
Seems like the may have jumped the gun on a new date scheme? At one time they did quarterly updates, then switched to April/August/December. The graph in post 1 was up for a while and then pulled down. Seems like they are toying with new dates and posted them prematurely? In the recent past they always posted the graph in the same month. So if they are switching to Jan/May/Sept then I would expect the new graphs not to come out until after Jan. 1.
Oops. Missed that. Likely some drone just used the wrong scale and it got pushed out. But more fodder for the conspiracy crowd!Quote:
Originally Posted by BrentF
might start to see a few "engine fires" if you know what I mean ;)
Ferrari had many "flat line" periods, ride it out and enjoy the car
Not sure if the original poster was happy or sad about the flat lining of early Porsche values. I have been collecting and selling american and foreign manufactured cars since the early 1970's. Most cars I kept for many years and enjoyed driving and doing my own maintenance.
I can tell you that early Porsche's are just like any other low number production cars, they will continue to rise in value.
The bottom line, when it comes to highly desired cars is they are not making them anymore.
Enjoy the hobby.
Lash
Worry about things you can control.:D
+1.........Quote:
Originally Posted by skinnerd
True, and more and more of the best are finding their way into collections, creating an artificial market shortage of an already-scarce commodity...Quote:
Originally Posted by Lash LaRowe
The January charts are back up.
http://i57.tinypic.com/4lz6p.png
As Bill Simmeth pointed out, Hagerty has now posted their January values (below), which are no different than Hagerty's accidental posting of a few weeks ago (above):
http://i62.tinypic.com/qq241v.png
Flat lining is good. Diving is bad. Market needs to slow done and do a price check in aisle 7 please. We'll hopefully see that the Scottsdale cars will sell for sensible, sustainable values. RM has at least one 1973S that one can use as a bellweather. According to Hagerty, Condition 1 1973 S cars still eaked out a gain. Condition 2-4 dropped significantly.
Ravi
January-March is slow in all car markets. Some of the "ask" prices have gotten out of hand too resulting in "No-Sale" status. To be brutally truthful there is a lot of overpriced junk floating around.
ohhhhhhh noooooooo!!!!!!!!!!
Well, you knew this was coming.
Ha. True, but ignored by those with an agenda.Quote:
Originally Posted by BrentF
The green line on the Hagerty Valuation for the 1973S is my car. It has created quite a dilemma for me. One on hand it is nice to see the price increase ... though I never expected it to be so valuable. On the other hand, I love driving the 911S and don't want to stop. When does a Porsche become too valuable to drive? For now, the plan is to continue to carefully drive the car. However, to be smart about it, my insurance agent contacts Hagerty several times a year. I smile and pay the increased bill.
Every time I drive the car, I bless myself and ask Jim to take care of me, and second to protect the car. How could I not be superstitious about this car?
There is much to juggle ... value, maintenance, appearance, originality, weather, car shows, and enjoyment.
Many of us are facing that problem.
Pay the insurance and drive the car. Have fun, you are one of the few that actually drive their car and enjoy them the way they were ment to. I am sure Jim and Ferry and smiling at you.Quote:
Originally Posted by Sepia911S
But, you know what Candyce ?
WE only go thru this pop stand once. If we deliberate with too an extreme set of parameters, we lose sense of the 'joy' of ownership....
I have come to terms with how much grief a set of circumstances surrounding a car, albeit a very great sportscar , is going to create for me the owner.
I don't do foolish stuff to risk integrity of the car, but have adopted a more philosophical approach to enjoyment. I note guys like Ralph Lauren and Jerry Seinfeld have also. And they seem to drive their 959s, priceless Ferraris, and rare Porsche race cars and # 1 editions when and where they want.
Sure they can afford to, but there has to be a sense of preservation mixed with 'freedom'..... the LOVE of the car needs to be felt in it's balance within our souls.
Jerry had to give a little lip to that innocuous bumper thumper last year, but he IS driving and enjoying it. Probably not worrying about the depreciation curve or loss of value over another stone chip.
I would have done the same over my 200 dollar salt beater ......but maybe gotten over it pretty quickly also:)
But, if I had a multi- million dollar collector species and only found pleasure in glaring at it's photos or viewing it behind 'glass', I would soon tire of the allure. The joy of ownership would lose it's true reality.
The hour of true joy DOES only come with the experience it was designed for: interaction of the human soul with a mechanical, unfeeling device. A device that was expressly designed to give man pleasure thru it's involvement with man.
Hi Candyce, Don & Mark. It was a beautiful sunny day in Chicago (almost 30 degrees) and I had both of my cars out for a couple hours each. Got my original 14" fuch's back on my 914-6.
Attachment 317990Attachment 317991
Thank you Mark, Don, and Mike for your words. I did't mean to "take over" this thread, only to point out early Porsches are valuable on a much more personal level especially friendships, memories, dreams, and the joy of driving. Be aware of the value, protect yourself, and drive your car.
Now when I start the car, I will ask Ferry for his blessings, too? ;)