Thinking of leaving Early 911S for 997/991

[digit3]

I parlayed funds from a 997.2 Turbo S towards a low mile 964 and am midway through a bare metal restomod of a longhood. No looking back. The 997 was an amazing car with great handling and blinding speed but I rarely found opportunities to open it up to 150mph+ and at regular speeds it just wasn't that fun. I love the smell, handling, sound, and general visceral feel of the old cars. Good luck with your decision!

[stout]

Interesting thread, and many of the views shared seem to reflect a simple idea: What's right for one driver may not be for another.

Fwiw, while having an early Porsche around has been a constant for 30+ years, the times when I had a more modern Porsche made me appreciate my early one even more—and vice versa. First time was with a well-used 986 2.5 (which was a LOT of fun), which left me with the viewpoint that I'd rather have a pair of "lesser" Porsches than a single gem from either era. From time to time, that pairing has been repeated with various 986/987/981/991 models. So I might look at selling that 1966 911 and replacing it with a 912 or 914 plus a 987/981 or 997/991.

Having been left behind by the skyrocketing values of longhoods (and still hopeful a SWB is in my future somehow/someway), the current pairing is my old shed of a 914 and a 991.2 C2. Love both for different reasons, and prefer the 991.2 Carrera to all 997 Carreras save the GTS. YMMV, but the Carrera & Carrera T are among the very best Porsche road cars of the last 20 years IMO, and I have a fair bit of seat time in modern 911s.

While I agree 991s are "perceptionally" too big (when parked and in normal driving), they do that 928 thing of shrinking when driven spiritedly. Relatively speaking, anyway. You might also be surprised to know a narrow 991 C2 is the same width as a 997 C2, ~0.5 inch lower, and only 1.5~ inches longer despite adding several inches to its wheelbase to make the rear seats more usable while adding stability and better ride characteristics. Downside is further a loss in the "traditional 911" way a 997 goes down backroads…the 991 doesn't "hobby horse" down the road quite as much, so you no longer have to account for the rear engine in quite the same way you did in 997s and all earlier 911s. Interestingly, lightly optioned 991 C2s weigh 31xx-32xx lbs, or about the same as most 964 C2s, and the 991 has the same wheelbase as a tiny 914—though its overhangs are a "bit" longer. The 991's added track width and front tire over the 997 also contribute to a real leap in capability, which may be why I prefer less power, less tech, and three pedals in 991s, but again YMMV and there's something out there for everybody.

Having just returned from a 3,000-mile "commute" for work in one, the base 991.2 C2 is plain brilliant whether you're storming back roads on the Santa Fe 500 or pulling 500+ miles between refuelings in 7th gear. I don't find myself wanting any more modern 911 than this, or a 997 even if I prefer the 997's styling in some ways as well as its smaller perceptional size and "more 911" greenhouse. About the only critical thing wrong with the 991 is its lack of a spare tire, although that's a problem with all 997s and 991s delivered in the US and many other markets.

Finding a good mechanic to work on my air-cooled flat six is getting tougher, mostly in terms of timelines—even here in the Bay Area. And I am less likely to park the car as I once did. But I still can't really think about being without it. One drive, and it does everything a modern Porsche simply can't. There's no replacement for a truly low curb weight and real simplicity…and that arguably ended in 1974. Or 1976. Or was it…?

Edit: Should have added that 997s or 991s don't solve all of the woes of owning an early Porsche. Good mechanics are still hard to come by, and the cars are more complex too…and did I mention no spare tire?

[Longballa]

I tell people all the time. Own an old one and a new one. I have my 72 of course which I'll pick almost every time for a back country road drive and my 87 with A/C and power windows and central locking (3.4 twin plug, short geared, turbo brake lightened car). Family cars are not 911's. That's a Panamera. I'll always have more fun driving the 72. It's a hot rod and that makes a difference. I'm not a SWB guy so can't really comment on that. I've almost twice bought a Carrera T and I'm always on the look for the right one spec'd the way I want. I driven 2 Carrera T's and they are sweet. The modern Porsche's are awesome but again If I could only have one it's the 72 hands down.

[kent olsen]

Scott
You and I agree on the 72. I've had mine for about 23 years. The one thing I notice on the newer Porsches is how "big" they are. I guess that's because I like smaller cars. I also have a classic Mini Cooper and really enjoy racing around in it. The Mini and the Porsche are quick and easy to handle. Well not to begin with. I had to learn to drive the Porsche but over the years I've modified the suspension, driven track days on tracks on the west coast and Florida and Georgia. Now she goes where ever she's pointed. This includes 9:1 power to weight. Then I got the Mini. What a difference. But I found a simple fix to make the front wheel drive into handling like a go-cart. It was simple - an adjustable rear swaybar.

But then I do have a big car. It's a 65 Corvette roadster. Big compared to my Mini/Porsche but small compare to the newer Vette's. You can tell my age I'll never own an electric car!!!!

[frederik]

That's settled then -- one needs a classic and a modern 911/914/etc.

Pete, it was actually something (I think an editorial?) you wrote in an edition of 000 a few years ago that triggered my decision to buy a more modern 911 alongside my classic Targa, for which my thanks.

BTW, I disagree that 911s can't be family cars. I have three children so obviously we don't all fit in a 911, but if my wife doesn't come along I squeeze everyone and our luggage in the 996 and my children (and I) love it. The Targa is too hectic/noisy for longer trips this way unfortunately.

[haul]

BTW, I disagree that 911s can't be family cars.

same here and I think I can talk for Karim also.....our children spend 10thousands of kms on the back seats.....
all in our "old cars...they grew up with and in the car. They still love it.
I was generous and did install some venetian blinds at the rear window to let them have shadow on the back seat.
this is why I will never have a targa...the kids will have a melt down in the rear glass house..
Luggage has never been an issue...the trunk is large enough and I do have for exactly this reason a roof rack.
we will enjoy further, up to the moment they do grow out .. ...

br haul

[stout]

same here and I think I can talk for Karim also.....our children spend 10thousands of kms on the back seats.....
all in our "old cars...they grew up with and in the car. They still love it.

^ Love it.

Every time I hear someone suggest 911s aren't family cars, I think about Terry Z. with the 1968 Targa he bought new. Family of four, cross country to the Porsche Parade every year, with all luggage in and a custom rack on the back for a wheel/tire set for autocross. Terry has to be coming up on 500,000 miles now, and I watched in 2013 as a group of new GT3 RSs couldn't beat Terry's times on 15x7s and 205/50s all around until the afternoon session. I also had to wonder: Who's having more fun? Legendary.

Anyone with a 996/997 or 991/992 has it easy by comparison. The difference between them: My wife, who isn't all that short, has to hunch forward in a 996/997's rear seat but can sit straight up with her head just under the glass in a 991/992 thanks to the longer wheelbase (which I don't love, btw). Neither are an option for her on a long drive, but either are fine to get across town. Our daughter has done hours in the back while we had plenty of space up front. That's going to change at some point, but I find driving an occasionally packed 997/991 vastly preferable to driving a usually empty Panamera/Cayenne.

Should've said, however, that when it came time to evacuate our family for a wildfire last year and I had to choose between 914 and 991, the modern one was left behind. And yeah, that felt funny. But there is no replacing the early cars and the way they feel, smell, sound, and drive—and there won't be, either.

[rgupta250]

Should've said, however, that when it came time to evacuate our family for a wildfire last year and I had to choose between 914 and 991, the modern one was left behind. And yeah, that felt funny. But there is no replacing the early cars and the way they feel, smell, sound, and drive—and there won't be, either.

Now that's putting your money where your mouth is...love it!

[haul]

………the adventures will continue…

[Longballa]

Good call as you'd regret selling it.