997 GT3 vs early 911 hot rod?

[jtrichel]

Ok, this may sound like a goofy question at first, but follow me on this one. I have a 2008 GT3 on order. It will be one of only 105 or so to be sold in the U.S. I am buying it as a weekend fun driver, occasional DE type of car. I do not spend hard core time at the track. None of the other newer 911s has ever done it for me, but I believe this car to probably be the most that Porsche will ever get out of the 3.6 NA engine. A real drivers car, pretty simple/pure on the inside (I have it optioned with very little).

However --- I have also always been interested in purchasing a properly restored 911S or maybe even a high standards RS/R type of recreation... well documented and using the very best stuff.

For me, while these two cars may seem totally different, both fill a niche of fun/raw weekend Porsche driving. Obviously the GT3 will be a much safer car, with good A/C, warranty, etc. But then a 70s car will tug at the emotions with the air cooled, light experience (no HP can make up for weight)

My last Porsche was a 993 S, and I loved it, but just not quite fast/raw enough for me.

I figure that if the GT3 is approx. $110k, the 70s 911 that I describe here could easily be in the $60s.

So the question is -- has anyone ever considered the GT3 as a semi-suitable substitute for the early 911 experience? If $40k wasnt enough to make a big difference in either direction, what would you do? Obviously this is a personal choice, but I am just curious if anyone else has wrestled with it...

Other than this board, what are some good resources for the type of 70s 911 that I am describing here?

thanks for any info and/or opinions

[Mr9146]

Around here we call that a "quality problem" ... you really can't go wrong either way.

With the late model car you're going to get the benefits of technology - creature comforts like air, power everything, etc. With the early 911 you're going to have to deal with quirkiness and the inherent faults of vintage technology. Therin, as they say, lies the rub.

It all boils down to what type of person you are. Can you deal with a car that may not have air conditioning, power windows, and a quality sound sytem? Are you willing to put up with the occasional snort, burp or fart that comes with a vintage, air-cooled motor? Can you get past the fact that, when it's hot out, your car is going to be a complete DOG?

I know that if I had to make a choice between outright performance and quirkiness I'd choose the latter. For me, all the ills of the early cars are endearing ... they have a certain character and purity of form that has been slowly diluted over the years. Sure, the GT3 may have brought some of the past into the present, but it's still a modern car and, therefore, less "real" than the early iron.

Like I said, it all boils down to the type of person you are ... but with 996 GT3s trading in the 70s, there's really no reason you can't have both.

Welcome to board, BTW.

[Eade Hopkinson]

So the question is -- has anyone ever considered the GT3 as a semi-suitable substitute for the early 911 experience? If $40k wasnt enough to make a big difference in either direction, what would you do? Obviously this is a personal choice, but I am just curious if anyone else has wrestled with it...

I did wrestle with it, and I thought life was too short not to do both, so you should get one of each. That is what I did. As Marco said, my (GT3RS) has all the creature comforts, air, cruise, PASM, etc. It has 415HP, 3.6, but the weight is 3,055 or so. It is VERY rough ride, as all articles attest. I have over 2,500 miles on mine, what a thrill. It goes like stink, handles like you can not believe, truly amazing, I would feel comfortable in it at 193MPH. The 73 RSR look is bare bones, no air, no nothing, RSR coil over suspension, only has about 300HP, 3.6, but also the weight is only about 2305 with a full tank of gas. Rough ride, but over 130, no where near as stable as the GT3RS. Goes like stink, handles like you can not believe, truly amazing. I am currently building a 3.9 with real High butterfly injection, for this car, should be about 400Hp, G50 5 speed from Patrick Motor Sports, should be a real thrill in 2300 pound car. My suggestion, do Both If you want to PM me, I would be happy to get into more detail with you, again, welcome to the site.

[jtrichel]

thanks for the advice...

let's see:

- i wish i could afford to do both, but I cannot... needs to be either /or
- i love my 66 912 and i loved my 993 S, for all the reasons described here (the smell of the interior, lightweight, quirks, history, etc)
- although i can afford the GT3, i guess money always matters, and i would think that there is probably a $50k or so difference, so a plus/nod in the direction of the early car

So Eade, if you could only have one, which would you have? (Also, do keep in mind that I cannot afford a 997 GT3 RS, only an 'ordinary' GT3)...

[Eade Hopkinson]

thanks for the advice...

let's see:

- i wish i could afford to do both, but I cannot... needs to be either /or
- i love my 66 912 and i loved my 993 S, for all the reasons described here (the smell of the interior, lightweight, quirks, history, etc)
- although i can afford the GT3, i guess money always matters, and i would think that there is probably a $50k or so difference, so a plus/nod in the direction of the early car

So Eade, if you could only have one, which would you have? (Also, do keep in mind that I cannot afford a 997 GT3 RS, only an 'ordinary' GT3)...

First, as far as performance and handling, the GT3 is very close to the GT3RS, so you would not really see a difference driving either one. Save your money and buy the GT3. If I had to keep one, once I have the 3.9 and the G50 in the RSR, I would keep it over the GT3RS. Just plain raw power, a real thrill, especially when you consider the car is 34 years old. And I am not usually driving over 130, so top speed is not really a factor. With that in mind, I have more in my RSR than I do in the GT3RS. So building a car like it is not cheap either. I have air, cruise, etc. in my daily driver, a Ford 4 wheel drive pickup. The sound of the RSR is wonderful, nothing like it. Good luck, and let the Force Be With You.

[jtrichel]

First, as far as performance and handling, the GT3 is very close to the GT3RS, so you would not really see a difference driving either one. Save your money and buy the GT3. If I had to keep one, once I have the 3.9 and the G50 in the RSR, I would keep it over the GT3RS. Just plain raw power, a real thrill, especially when you consider the car is 34 years old. And I am not usually driving over 130, so top speed is not really a factor. With that in mind, I have more in my RSR than I do in the GT3RS. So building a car like it is not cheap either. I have air, cruise, etc. in my daily driver, a Ford 4 wheel drive pickup. The sound of the RSR is wonderful, nothing like it. Good luck, and let the Force Be With You.

Thanks again. I am not concerned with top speed either, more weekend/street/DE fun. I am near some fun country road driving. One more question for you --- if you were looking to find an RS/RSR type of recreation like what you are building, where would you go look? Obviously I am here because I know that is a good place... where else? While I am mildly mechanically inclined, I would rather pay a premium for someone elses completed project (to very high standards). We have an excellent air cooled shop close to where I live who would do most of the maintenance/work on the car.

[Eade Hopkinson]

Thanks again. I am not concerned with top speed either, more weekend/street/DE fun. I am near some fun country road driving. One more question for you --- if you were looking to find an RS/RSR type of recreation like what you are building, where would you go look? Obviously I am here because I know that is a good place... where else? While I am mildly mechanically inclined, I would rather pay a premium for someone elses completed project (to very high standards). We have an excellent air cooled shop close to where I live who would do most of the maintenance/work on the car.
You are right on, try and buy a car that someone has already built. Usually you can pick them up for much less than you could build one for. This site is one of the BEST for the type of car you are looking for. It may take a lot of time, and a lot of looking, so do not get discouraged. Keep watching this site, call everyone that has anything you think you might be interested in. You want to do your homework before you spring for a car. Be Patient, and ask lots of questions. There are soooo many people on this site that can help you in your search. There are also people all over the U.S on this site, that know of someone who can do a PPI on the car, if it is not a known car on this site. Go back to the cars for sale on this site, you can go back for a long time, like months and months. Look at all of the posts, and what cars sold for. It will give you great insite as to what you are looking for may cost. What you are looking for is not easy to find, so do your homework. That way, when you see what you are looking for, you can pull the trigger real fast. Hope all of this helps, again, PM me if you want to speak further.

[Mr9146]

Wasn't Chris selling his "Rat Rod" RSR with a 3.2?

Check the For Sale section ... I think that car would be the way to go if it's not already sold. It looks to be a good platform and, although I'm not familiar with the car, from the look of Chris' ST the RSR is bound to be pretty f'n nice.

Here's the link: http://www.early911sregistry.org/for...&highlight=RSR

[Grady Clay]

Wonderful thread.

I too am facing this quandary.

Two years ago this October I had a cashiers check in my pocket and airline ticket in hand to buy the 2000 Cup winner. My intention was to drive it to the grocery store and then drive to races.

Last weekend in Cup cars and a 4-cam 904 inspired me more.

I have owned way many special Porsche race cars (2 904s, 2000GS/GT, 718 and more). The point is how to have fun with them. Today, at my lame old age, I thumb my nose and want to drive the most outrageous on the street. Well … perhaps some track time.

My goal is to communicate the enthusiasm to my kid (now 21). Mazda Star Pro is his wish. I think I can convince him to Porsche.

BTW, Eade was a Rennenhaus customer 30+ years ago,
Still friends.

Best,
Grady

[jtrichel]

nice sentiments in this thread... please keep the opinions coming...

$100k+ ish for a new GT3 vs. $50k+ ish for an early 911 hot rod

Mainly street use, some DE, etc.

What is the better 'bang for buck' in terms of Porsche experience?