Anyone have pics of 911 360 0328 R4 RSR?

[Longballa]

I have a Minichamps model of this car and was wondering if any of you have pics of this car. It's Grand Prix Weib mit Vipergrun on the model. Thanks, -Scott

[sithot]

Porsche 911 Carrera RSR #911 360 0328 R4 – Brumos Porsche-Audi Corp. (USA)

http://www.racingsportscars.com/phot...-07-22-059.jpg

http://www.racingsportscars.com/phot...-02-04-059.jpg

Tom

[CurtEgerer]

The unique thing about this car is it is the only 911 (maybe the only street-based car of any type?) to compete in the CanAm - Watkins Glen 1973. It qualified 19th, ahead of some McLarens and finished 9th

[HughH]

This car has a fascinating history.Delivered in new york jan 19th 1973-won daytona outright-then sent back to the factory-11th feb-developed as martini long tail and then "verschrotten"-destroyed/scrapped??? also contradicts some other accounts of this chassis-john starkey and i have discussed this car-any other accounts of what happened to this car.

Raj

i also thought it had been written off BEFORE It came back as a long tail for Watkins glen.

I recently saw another photo of a car supposed to be it at Le Mans in 1974 entered by a Mexican team Rebaque Rojas-Racing Team in S3.0
It was Driven by: Guillermo Rojas (MEX)/Hector Rebaque (MEX)/Fred van Beuren, Jr. (MEX). but DNF (distributor)

[HughH]

I don't know why it went back to the factory after Daytona - maybe as a part of a test program to see the impact of 24 hours of racing. the "scrapped" notation may be that it was pulled apart and inspected after the race and then rebuilt.

After a 24 hour race you would have to do that anyway if you wanted to continue using it. I don't think that Brumos were short of cars to use in their race program so it probably would have been better off back at the factory - it may have even been a condition of them getting an "R" car in the first place.

in any event it was sent back to Brumos as a longtail in about the start of July.

I have the 6 hour race as being on July 21 and the Cam Am the next day - July 22. I cant really read some of the numbers on the cars. It is obvious that the shots with Can Am car in it are from that race and the race number is 58.

The one with the Ferrari 365 GTB/4 in it must be from the 6 hour so the RSR's number there would be 59. but i cant tell what the number is where it is by itself.

I believe it was the same car that ran in both races - R4. It was then sold to Hector Rebaque and used by him at Le Mans the following year, and 2 weeks later at the Austrian 1000km at Zeltweig in June 1974 (car 40) as well as at Daytona (car #5) in 1975.

I have a shot of a car that looks like this car in its Daytona winning format - note the lights which only useful for a 24 hour race. I don't know if this is R4 or not. Does anyone recognize the racetrack in the background?? (I am hopeless at identifying US racetracks ) It may just be a publicity car painted up to look like the Daytona winner.

[xenifizi]

Hello Hugh,
This shot has been taken either before Daytona or it was of another car as you indicate.
Anyway the Daytona winning Brumos car did have an extended chin spoiler, it also did have the n° 59 on the side door etc...
I think this picture was taken at Weissach. The cars in the back are not on a track but on the public road.
All the best,
JD

[Longballa]

I have 2 Minichamps models of the same car and didn't even know it. They made a model of it racing with the Brumo's colors and another one with out all the graphics. I'm building a RSR inspired car and going towards Grand Prix White with the Green Carrera graphics not the typical blue. I'm sure there are no pics of it how it was delivered to Brumo's before all the graphics? Thanks for the pics and info guys. -Scott

[72targa]

What does "R4" mean?

[HughH]

What does "R4" mean?

Peter

Each of the RSR prototypes (ie factory race cars that ran in prototype class (group 5) rather than the normal class that a "standard RSR" (group 4) or a standard RS would race in) had another number assigned to it ( from R1 to R8 in 1973) as well as its chassis number.

This continued into 1974 with the turbo prototypes. These cars were known by their "R" number more than by their chassis number. I think in all there were about 13 "R" numbered cars, a couple of which had multiple identities.

For example R8 (RS 0974) was a 3 litre RSR prototype in 1973 (briefly before it was wrecked) and then turned into 1974 RSR turbo race #21 at 1974 Le Mans for Koinigg and Schurti.

Also R2 (RS020) seems to have been a rallye car at the 1972 Tour de Corse before later becoming a track oriented RSR prototype at Le mans test 1973, targa florio 1973 and later Le Mans 1973 before being retired to testing and eventually the museum. (see threads on "real targa car" and "Tour de Corse cars")

So R4 was the internal race department name for RS 0328 and having a "R" name signifies that it was a werks prototype.


Most of the "R" cars in 1973 and 1974 were run by the werks "Martini" team, although a couple of the cars were run by favored private teams.

R3 (RS 0307) was the Penske car for Donohue and Follmer at Daytona and later the Holbert car with race number 14.

R4 as we discussed above was the Brumos car

R2 was a Martini car for most of 1973 but was the Sonauto entered car for Peter Gregg at the 1973 Le Mans. All the available evidence suggests that it was a factory prepared entry loaned to the team for the race.

R6 (0588) was sold to Penske racing after a full season in Europe and then was raced by them at Watkins Glen in 1973 as car 6

Running these cars in prototype class meant that the factory was not competing with its customer RSR's as they raced in a lower class (group 4) and also meant that they could make running changes to the configuration without falling foul of the eligibility rules. Therefore they were also mobile test beds for new parts etc for the customer teams for the next season.

[John Starkey]

Gentlemen,

According to Helmuth Bott, who I interviewed in 1986:

R4, 911 360 0328 was the Daytona winner and was then sent back to the factory for inspection and dismantling. Helmuth Bott then told me that the car was "Verschrotten" literally-Broken up/scrapped.

The photo above shows the car at, I believe, the Nordschliefe, Nurburgring.

Jack Atkinson, who I have spoken to at length over the years, also confirmed that the car went back to the factory on February 11th, 1973. I have always thought it a possibility that the car may have been used again but, to date, I have seen no evidence of that. Of course, it MAY have been re-numbered by the factory as 911 360 0576 but this seems extremely unlikely to me. I can't see any reason for this happening.

Brumos then took delivery of 911 360 0727, another RSR, (but this time a "customer" car, not one run by the factory), from the factory, that Peter Gregg ran for the rest of the season and, with it, won the 1973 IMSA GT Championship. He sold the car to another racer who ran it in IMSA in 1974 and 1975 and then sold it. It may still be around.

For the Watkins Glen 6 Hours and the Can Am Race, Jack Atkinson told me that the factory sent Brumos a Longtailed car, which raced as # 58 and #59 in the above races with Gregg/Haywood driving it. Jack's diary confirmed this as R7, 911 360 0576. It was mistakenly mis-identified by "Motoring News" later on as "The Daytona 24 Hour winner of 1973", when it ran at Le Mans in 1974, driven by Peter Gregg/Brumos' customer, Hector Rebaque/Van Beuren/Rojas.

The car was subsequently badly damaged on it's trailer in Mexico and broken up. Some of the parts wound up in a collector's hands.

I hope this helps.

Chassis No: 911 360 0686 R7.
Prod. No: 103 4689.
G/box no: 783 0668.
Built: 2/73.
Martini sponsored car.
Colour: Grand Prix White

1973:
06/5: Spa 1000Km: Follmer/Joest, #40; 10th.
27/5: Nurburgring 1000Km: Muller/van Lennep: Group 5. Race # 6; 5thOA.
9-10/6: 24 Hours of Le Mans: Muller/van Lennep, # 46; 4thOA, (in Sportscar class).
24/6: Osterreichring 1000Km: Schurti/Koinnig, #8; 9thOA, 1st in GT class.

Sent back from the factory and collected from New York on 12th July by Jack Atkinson of the Brumos team.

21/7: Watkins Glen 6-hours: (end of season and the day before the Can-Am race at the same circuit). Race no:59 in Brumos colours. Gregg/Haywood; 7th O.A.
22/7: Can-Am. Watkins Glen. Race no:58. Driven with "tired" 3-litre engine.
Gregg; Finished 9th in "Long-tail" form.

Sold to Hector Rebaque.
To Brumos for repainting in November/December.

1974:
15-16/6: Le Mans. Rebaque/Rojas. Race no: 46: DNF. (Distributor drive).
30/6: Austrian 1000 kms. G. Rojas/ H. Rebaque/F. van Beuren. Race no: 40.(According to Motoring News, this was the 1973 Daytona winning car). 33rd in practice, 14thOA.

Jack Atkinson, Peter Gregg's crew chief says that he delivered the car to Hector Rebaque of Mexico on 31/8/73.
20/10: Mexico City: G. Rojas/ H. Rebaque/F. van Beuren, #15; 1st.