72T - Frustration

[jond911t]

Greetings all:

I'm looking for some suggestions in regards to some recent repair work that seems to be going south. Let me first state that I am not much of a DIY guy these days as work / job is keeping me extremely busy. I'm hoping that one or several of you can point me in the right direction.

In late October early November of 2007 I decided to get a variety of issues dealt with in regards to my '72T. I saved diligently for over a year managing so stash a little over 3K in a "hidden slush" fund. I had the car towed to a very well respected shop in the H.E.B. area here in the Dallas metroplex. NOT Ed Mayos. In previous years on one occasion back in 2000 I used 911 Enterprises and in April of 2005 I used the shop,which I'm not going to name, for the first time. I am / was / will / continue to be very thankful, appreciative of the level of service, and happy with the work done by both of these shops.

With that said let me tell you a little about the car. I posted a small photo in the "Show your ride" thread a while back and am still trying to figure out how to get around size limitations. I'll attach a couple more pics at the end of this post. This is 72T currently carries a 2.2 70T engine and 901 tranny. Wish it still had the numbers matching engine and transmission as I have the original window sticker and Porsche maintenance record along with several service receipts from the first and second owner. Originally purchased in California and somehow made it's way here to Dallas in the early 80's.

When I had the car delivered to the "unamed" shop I sent a letter with some details regarding what I'd like to be evaluated / repaired / estimated / etc. In addition I asked them to take their time as winter was approaching and the car would otherwise sit in the garage. Long story short, and a ton, not mentioned. I get a call on January 10 of this year, "Your car is ready" , great I go check it out fires right up, looks good, sounds good, feels good, pay the bill and inquire about my missing drivers side floor mat. Granted the mat is 36 years old, however, it only had one small wear mark from the heel at the gas pedal. I figure I must have pulled it out prior to having it sent to them as they have no "old" 911 floor mats laying around. WRONG. God carpet kits are expensive!! I get the vehicle towed back to the house here in far East Dallas after the following were repaired.

Weber 40 IDA 3C carbs rebuilt, new master cylinder, new brake lines, all new pedal bushings, new fuel pump, all fuel lines replaced, change oil and filter (Brad Penn oil.. ), spark plugs (BOSCH WR7DC, W175T30). In addition they took care of a few minor details, reattached a chrome trim piece, fixed a turn signal bulb issue, and a few other things that they didn't bother to mention on the bill.

I appreciate you continuing to read this saga.... and I apologize for the length.

To date I've put approximately 250 miles on this vehicle since repair. Generally weekend drives, a little around the bario here, and several highway miles at "various" speeds to try and keep the carbs clean. Since the cars return it continues to get harder and harder to start. I noticed a bit of an idle issue almost immediately with the car where after warm-up and driving a bit and coming to a stop the idle stays around 1700 RPM's. I can engage the clutch a bit and the idle will return to what I guess is normal, around 750 -760 RPM's. Last weekend after about 15-20 pumps on the gas pedal, with the pump running it finally fired up, sounded like it was missing, but cleared up and fired on all cylinders after several minutes. Tonight, with severe weather approaching, same thing, as I had to move the wifes new car into the garage as well. This time, however, it never cleared up, and after ten minutes of running idle would never get above 500 RPM's and the air reeked of fuel.

My question to all of you is this. Should I contact the shop and inform them of these issues or should I pull the plugs and post photos so all of you can tell me how much I need to start saving for the next go around.

Any feedback or advice would be greatly appreciated.

To the best of my knowledge, this engine has never been rebuilt. I can verify that it did have the chain ramps upgraded at one point, but does not have pressure fed tensioners. In addition, the valves were adjusted back in 2005 and Carrera covers were installed at that time, a few seals were also replaced. The vehicle has one small oil leak at this point. Between 2005 and the current repairs the vehicle was only driven about 500 miles due to the bad carbs. They popped, spit, gurgled, stalled, prior to this current rebuild.

RANT OFF

[Flat Six, inc.]

Just give the shop a call.......I'd appreciate knowing if something was wrong with a car I recently worked on......

[boba]

First, talk to the shop that did the work for you. Have them look at the car and see if it is somthing simple. When you talk to them get them to go over the issues they noted and addressed an any that were not delt with.

If you are not a DIY type of guy you need to be ready to pay an expert to take care of your car. Some of the best are willing to educate you as they take care of your car. As your car is a bit of a Frankenstein you need someone who understands all the bits and peices used to create yours.

As I said when you first posted in 'show your ride' look for our get togethers and come out, you will find a wealth of knowledge in the area.

Regards,

Bob

[jond911t]

First, talk to the shop that did the work for you. Have them look at the car and see if it is somthing simple. When you talk to them get them to go over the issues they noted and addressed an any that were not delt with.

If you are not a DIY type of guy you need to be ready to pay an expert to take care of your car. Some of the best are willing to educate you as they take care of your car. As your car is a bit of a Frankenstein you need someone who understands all the bits and peices used to create yours.

As I said when you first posted in 'show your ride' look for our get togethers and come out, you will find a wealth of knowledge in the area.

Regards,

Bob

Bob and Aaron thanks for the feedback! I posted here specifically for this type of advice. I am somewhat of a DIY guy! I've dropped this motor and tranny on a few occasions myself and tracked down a couple of issues, but Webers scare the heck out of me. Frankenstein is the exact way to describe this "thing", and at this point from what I've read here and at Pelican they all are. I can thank Dusty at 911 Enterprises for working the oil delivery issues out with this vehicle. In regards to the "get togethers" I really wanted to take part in the Hill Country Rally, but due to the lack of faith in this car I had to take the pass. Can you blame me?

I'll contact the shop and keep you all posted. Your response is greatly appreciated. jd

[304065]

Is the engine running too rich or too lean?

What do the plugs look like?

Once you answer that question you can then start investigating the alternative branches of fuel and ignition to figure out the problem. It's probably something simple like too much fuel pressure (72T had MFI with system pressure of 2 bar, so when you try to push that into carbs which like 3,5 PSI the mixture is WAY too rich) or too little.

[Bob Pinkston]

Please contact the shop that did the work for you. They will be happy to help you sort out the problem. Webers can be cantankerous if the car is not driven regularly. Short run periods tend to get plugs fouled and make it difficult to start and clear out. Ideally, it needs to be driven long enough to get the operating temps up and all the "fluids" flowing. Once you adopt this driving habit, your car will be a pleasure to drive and trustworthy to take on the get-togethers.
But, please contact the shop that did the work. It might be something as simple as a little dirt that got trapped in a jet.
Good luck and happy driving.

[RPMClassic]

Aside from the above advice:

What fuel pump was installed? Is the system using a return line to the tank - your 70T engine uses a different fuel pump pressure than the engine that would have been in the car originally.

Do you have a way to measure the current fuel pressure?

Others might suggest otherwise, however when a car won't start - instead of pumping the crap out of the pedal and getting the plugs soaked - turn the key and let the pump run for 20 sec or so. Pump the pedal twice and turn the key. This allows enough air into the carb.

What is your battery voltage? Have you check your ground straps at the battery and the transmission?

Your 70T motor would have used a Marelli dizzy which has weights that can hang up the idle when they get worn out. Are you still running points?

Your original gas tank has an " in tank" brass screen for a filter and no other filter in the system. Have you checked to make sure that it is not clogged? Have you checked the banjo bolt screens on the carbs to make sure they are not clogged?

If the 72T MFI fuel filter is still in the engine compartment - check to see how it is routed ( either with a return line or without).

Keep us posted. Sounds like basic set up that can resolved without much drama.