Ultimate ST thread

[_gonbau]

Guys, since the right front fender is missing on the car in the factory shop, it's possible that it was removed to go to another part of the shop to add the flare and remove the fuel filler door....and then prepped with a coating to keep the welds fresh for later final paint. Why else would it be missing? That right front fender was not replaced before the June LeMans race, and it is clear it is a steel fender with the crunch maintaining its shape, and not being just cracked away as a FG fender would have.

um. Thanks for the explanation! It fits me. And adding the cube of the lighthouse on my part I do not need more to believe that it is metal instead of GRP. I understand that as said at the beginning it would be a "white" layer that was given to make the piece ready to paint after metal work. This layer used to be white? Or after the metal work did they turn black again?

[Yellow491]

I to this day and observing the photos from ignorance also think that it is Grp. If it were "metal" I think it would be at the point of the black primer like the rest of the bodywork but on the contrary "white" is observed. I had never stopped to look at the detail of the hub of the lighthouse commented but my opinion is that it is still Grp .... From my humble opinion, with that of the fins I mean. If they widened the car by means of arches (front and rear), the rear bumpers must also have been widened as was the front bumper. The porsche worked these rear bumpers in a specific way or can we find the same welding seams in different S / Ts made by the factory? I hope you understand the question.

I think i understand,you mean the wider extensions to the bumpers,mine were grp and moulded to fit the wider fenders in a one piece moulding,rather than cutting and extending etc

[Rennman]

To me it looks like the glass front fenders were offered early on with steel front fenders by 72. The M491 cars I have seen have steel front fenders.

[HughH]

By lightweight interior do you mean M470 delete? Presumably you mean the 930kg cars are a world of difference from a regular S?

No I was only talking about 1972 cars here. The "M470 delete", ie not having option M470 as a part of the build, applied only for 1970. From 1971 the option package changed away from having a specific M470 option to reinstate the trim to "E" level to having a "trim delete" option, M471, which carried on through to the RS in 1973.

So I meant that there was a world of difference between a purpose built M491 2.5 ST at werk1 and a regular production 911S even if that S had a M471 option. Almost all of the differences (apart from flared bodywork) were under the skin and especially were the mechanical parts like engine, cooling, reinforcing, electrical etc

[stretch]

It's not just the fender missing, the door is also missing.
Anyone who's done any lead work on these cars knows you wouldn't have the amount of lead preparation to do on a Porsche factory door skin to Factory steel fender.
Now GRP.... that's a different story.

Hugh.... can you post a picture of the spare parts list please. I am interested to see the part numbers for the front fender extensions.
This is the document in French that has all the part numbers. I can't seem to locate mine. Many thanks. Dave

[HughH]

Hi Dave
I am not certain which ones you mean I have the following out of the Gp4 homologation

however I also have this list that is easier to read and maybe a bit more pertinent for the bodywork

and these factory documents about (mainly) the 1972 ST's one of which has part numbers and another covers the "fiberglass issue" in 1972

[stretch]

Thanks Hugh, that's perfect. I don't seem to see the steel front fender flare offered.? Maybe i am missing it somehow.?

[letsrollbabe]

2 of the best known factory STs for 72 were the 'Monte' twins, used for rallying mostly. One ended up in So. Africa and there is a wonderful story on this board about that car. Here is a pic of one of them with a crunched left front fender and bent (Strahle) hood which happened in a 72 race, plus another showing the #70 hood with the small crunch in the bottom of the right hand fender. (page 9 of this thread)

Also, maybe the passenger door was off to get an aluminum skin put on, as was discussed on P. 18 of this thread.

[stretch]

It's only natural to put steel wings on cars that are doing the tough rallies. The door present in the picture is clearly prepared for lead loading. The factory aluminium door skins as in page 18 are sold in raw aluminium. Not possible to lead load on an aluminium door skin.

[_gonbau]

Really enjoy this conversation! I think I'm not the only one. Thank you very much for sharing the different thoughts!