Grundig Radio

[bob joyce]

This was in my 1968 911 L Targa..... I have no idea if it works. Or if it is worth having it checked-out/serviced...
Any opinions and even suggestions on repair shops would be appreciated...

[911MRP]

Bob

While there is a lot of rust on bracket otherwise seems pretty compete and decent condition? Any radio of this era has issues with components that don’t age well. Probably fairly straightforward for competent person to test and repair. Not sure it was a Porsche factory fitted M-option ( doubt it as dont recall it being listed in accessories lists ) but even if wasn’t plenty cars got aftermarket radios.

Some info here based on model name and number — seems to be 69-72 radio. It has European symbols denoting Medium wave and FM so the later was typically above base but topping out at typical 104 range in Europe is less than the typical 108 frequency range for sets sold in USA.

https://www.radiomuseum.org/r/grundi...lang_2500.html

Generally knobs with silver circles are more consistent with Mercedes Benz dash of era but I’m not familiar with this make of model of radio so who knows if Grundig even came with a plain black knob option more constant with a Porche dash ? Also on depending on the spindles could change for other knobs but to me that seems a shame to change survivor knobs.


While Blaupunkt and Becker (plus several others to lesser extent) are better known in Porsche I’d quite like to see more diversity in 911 dash. The fairly recent fashion to (re)fit a period Blaupunkt (typically default being the middle of range Frankfurt of roughly of right age) when no radio is shown in coa / paperwork is probably giving a much more limited impression of the richness of which brand and model radios got fitted aftermarket to a new 911 back in the day. While the fashion is safe so to not be called out as “incorrect” perhaps has become too narrow unimaginative therefore rather passé.

I suspect Grundig units ( and Grundig parts and ancillaries ) are perhaps harder to find than the seemingly never ending deluge of Blaupunkt “stuff” that I seem to have to wade through (usually from just one poster) when clicking the “new posts” view when rejoining this forum. With schematics who’s less common I doubt thee is much to tax restorers of the internals components ans failure modes of unit typical of this era. Up to you but maybe it’s worth testing and even if needed a paying to have second lease of life rather than the same old path as many others especially if this has was in that particular car for a long time? If something is in the car’s CoA then that is different as might want to find an orphan radio that is of brand type that is documented to approximate to what had at new. Dow Due to fashion and if never m-option maybe less familiar Grundig won’t command the same as price as better known Becker and Blaupunkt so that might be a factor if investing to renovate.

Speaking more generally than just car radio, I seem to recall from my younger days Grundig being a well known and respected electrical brand from Germany back in the day. German folks of a certain age might comment on its brand positioning vis a vis Blaupunkt but my vague impression (so I could be wrong) is Grundig were less automotive focused but more general consumer electric than Bosch’s sub brand Blaupunkt (or in its anglicised Blue Point name as sometimes used in early sixties in sales literature and often used in period car adverts here in UK)?

Just my tuppence-worth

Steve

[bob joyce]

Great information Steve.
This radio was in the car when it was imported to USA in 1978.
Was in the Targa roofed car parked in a field for about 40 years (thus the rusty bracket)
I don't know anything about radios. Would it play the U.S. FM broadcasts?...... I can't imagine why not.....
The bracket is pretty elaborate and is obviously the one designed for the radio.
But I vaguely remember when i removed it 5 years ago, the bracket did not "mate-up" with the body ..... so, it was no doubt installed aftermarket.
My impression is that Grundig is a quality brand....
I wonder if a Mercedies restorer would want to trade me for a Blaupunkt?...

[911MRP]

If works then a should pick up USA broadcasts provided your favourite station isn’t in the FM 104 -108 frequency range. I’m no expert in the marque but Mercedes seems to use Becker radio equipment but maybe Grundig was also fitted or perhaps they just put this style knob on to make it attractive aftermarket to Mercedes owners as they were popular cars with fairly well heeled buyers. I think around time options if factory were as follows but if nothing in Kardex CoA then, to my diversity point, aftermarket gave owners a lot more freedom

9330 Bremen
9327 Boston
9323 Frankfurt
9325 Koln
9326 New Yorker

The Frankfurt in italics might have had European and a USA capability variant the latter to cover the FM spectrum up to 108 in USA. Often the case of blaupunkt offered both North American and European versions of the Frankfurt their popular middle of lineup receiver. But in the case of New Yorker that was usually a USA market variant similar to the upmarket Koln. More detailed look into my reference material would clarify.

First step I’d suggest is see if it had a named radio brand and type on Kardex CoA etc to inform any decision. Also get a bench test what you have to see if functions. Rather depends thereafter if you are going for authenticity as at new if car was European delivered originally or full listening spectrum if car is now in NA? Visually a few differences like the range shown on dial graphic and most obvious typically AMFM buttons not LMKU used in European rest of world

I possibly have an original Blaupunkt colour brochure even one from USA or Canada market that year in hard copy and although a Grundig trade is not of interest to me might have a suitable radio unit for Europe. Pretty sure I have a working X series LMU Frankfurt from 66/67. The spec of a model 68 and its accessories was no doubt settled and published by factory in 67 for the MY68 cycle a slightly earlier one could have been the version used as fact yet fit inventory especially for early 68 car? Radios options did upgraded in year as Blaupunkt and Becker etc released their new range and inventory in supply chain gig consumed but for obvious chronological reasons a factory fitted radio’s generation might have lagged one year back . Aftermarket however due to being fitted after the car delivered maybe gave owner access to most current range or in some circumstances timing even got the nominal next year kit if radio fitter was sourcing fresh inventory to order — don’t know if Grundig model like Blaupunkt serial number can be decoded to production year of unit. Conjecture of course but perhaps the Grundig is car’s original aftermarket if due to the production years and timing when got around to first installed some third party retailer fitter had access to latest new Grundig a nominal 69-> model radio despite it being a Porsche model year 68 ? I might be overthinking it but does it seem likely a 69 ->push button radio model replaced push button similar tech if car had just got one in 68 ? Just a hunch but maybe it’s the cars original survivor aftermarket radio ?

Got lots of original technical reference material on my shelf bought from a retiring German repair technician - didn’t need it but couldn’t refuse buying all his binders as a job lot.





Steve

[bob joyce]

Thanks Steve.... This information gives me a deeper thought about keeping this radio with the car.
My 1968 911L Targa was built December 3 1967.
would that be too much of a reach to believe it was "aftermarket" installed.?

[dr914]

we used to call them GrunDOGS as they were extremely unreliable and a poor mans substitute for the Blaupunkt frankfurt. YOu would be much better off installing a period correct blaupunkt frankfurt and can even get it with ipod compatibility or bluetooth. We have the ones restored by the leading Blaupunkt guy in germany and sell them here at autoatlanta all of the time. The early 68 would wear the white letter one piece case Blaupunkt Frankfurt

[bob joyce]

George.... does your guy have the Frankfurt Blaupunkt with the US and European build....
It was a model built for both markets so the buttons would be labeled so.?

[911MRP]

we used to call them GrunDOGS as they were extremely unreliable and a poor mans substitute for the Blaupunkt frankfurt. YOu would be much better off installing a period correct blaupunkt frankfurt and can even get it with ipod compatibility or bluetooth. We have the ones restored by the leading Blaupunkt guy in germany and sell them here at autoatlanta all of the time. The early 68 would wear the white letter one piece case Blaupunkt Frankfurt

Interesting Grundig was perceived as a poor man’s choice? I am looking at a vintage price list from Germany that includes many radio makes both the Frankfurt US the Grundig 2500 that is the subject of the post are shown. At new price comparisons I am referencing is reliable as both are listed in same sheet of paper on same date by the same retailer. The Frankfurt US model is 210 DM and the Grundig Weltklang 2500 in Bob’s question is 200 DM. A 10DM delta seems a a negligible saving?

I havent checked the specs but think the Grundig had more watts than Frankfurt ? I don’t have a axe to grind either way simply sharing a black and white data point from reference material within the “longhood” period.

The Frankfurt US was a long way lower in price than their range topping Koln. Becker were typically more expensive for equivalent functionality than Blaupunkt

Never quite understand the fascination with Frankfurt and it now being being today’s default although it sold in huge volume and was featured in most every years lineup so is perhaps well recognised among the “German city name” convention they used for products it was typically a middle of range Blaupunkt offering; not really a rich man’s choice of the Blaupunkt range. Brochures I have from longhood era sometimes break the ranges into three tiers and Frankfurt was typically in the mid tier above standard but below super deluxe class units. I have the original Blaupunkt brochure printed for Canada with the North American lineup — one print date 368. And another print date 769. Both show the North American radio range.

Neither of those two brochures are relevant market or year for my 73 RS so not sure why have those beyond 72/3.


Also this bookshelf has just part of an extensive set of ring binder as printed by Blaupunkt for use by their professional service technicians which collectively gives a pretty detailed view of each model for much of the longhood era — handily a factory printed index that he’d annotated for each binder gives a fairly useful chronological order of the models some of which like Frankfurt evolved some confusingly under the same city model name for decades. Furthest fused by Norrh American a stereo vs mini versions being available in parallel.

Bought the set direct from a nice retiring old radio technician in Germany when I was at the Essen show iirc — couldn’t resist picking up his job lot for little money even though I don't actually need them as don’t work on them are a trove of period auto-radio authenticity info. I find often the repair outfits are not too particular in their sales claims of which unit is correct for what year car.

My Raleigh Chopper bicycle was in the late sixties the bees knees in my street (a special birthday present for being brave for enduring a tonsillectomy an operation which also had the additional benefit of ice cream jelly diet!)

However the natty chopper wasn’t equipped with a 12v radio in 69 -> so I have no first hand knowledge of Grundig vs Blaupunkt sound quality or reliability but do recall Grundig electrical products being generally well known in UK in the era.

Steve

[bob joyce]

well done Steve
2 scoops
rocky road and mint chocolate chip for you.............

[72targa]

IMHO, the Grundig is a much cooler part of your car’s history than putting in a correct Blaupunkt. I can’t remember the last time I saw a Grundig radio. It would be quite the conversation piece. Good luck with your decision.