"VW to buy Rest of Porsche AG" - Wall Street Journal today

[sithot]

The ML was once referred to as the Alabama Trash Can. We had one and it lasted 2 years before I could feel it coming apart around me.

[Mr9146]

Luke and Reza both make great points.

As a guy who works on the new cars I can say the only "future classics" worth hanging on to are the GT versions ... in particular the 996 GT3 because it has less computer trickery to gum up the works.

As for the VW take-over of Porsche, well, I see it as a body returning to the Earth. Porsche came from VW and so it goes that it shall eventually return to VW.

The cycle of life continues...

[letsrollbabe]

The VW takeover will help Porsche meet US emission laws requiring a 35 mpg fleet average in 2016, and the technology cost sharing will help hold down future developments. But the technology will be VW-AUDI owned and shared across platforms which over time may make it harder to distinguish a Porsche from the 'corporate' cars.

Marco, I hear what you are saying about the 996 GT3s, but man. they are not pretty, and are a low point in the 911 evolution I think.

[sithot]

No offense intended but the last 996 I drove reminded me of a Toyota Supra or Lexus. Very very Japanese in feel. This one had the dreaded RMS getting ready to take a dump and the engine sounded like a thrashing machine (meaning the IMS was on the way out too). Dealer wholesaled it to a podunk lot somewhere for the next unsuspecting sod to buy. These cars are the worst of the bunch. If you have to have one the rule of thumb is to budget for a new engine against the price of the car. It's can be a matter of when not if. Mileage doesn't matter either. Low mile (near 6 figure when new) cars out of warranty now are just as prone as high milers.
Porsches reputation also suffered with the auxiliary air injection on the 993's thanks to the EPA. ROW didn't have the stupid system.

[Kaleid]

No offense intended but the last 996 I drove reminded me of a Toyota Supra or Lexus. Very very Japanese in feel. This one had the dreaded RMS getting ready to take a dump and the engine sounded like a thrashing machine (meaning the IMS was on the way out too). Dealer wholesaled it to a podunk lot somewhere for the next unsuspecting sod to buy. These cars are the worst of the bunch. If you have to have one the rule of thumb is to budget for a new engine against the price of the car. It's can be a matter of when not if. Mileage doesn't matter either. Low mile (near 6 figure when new) cars out of warranty now are just as prone as high milers.
Porsches reputation also suffered with the auxiliary air injection on the 993's thanks to the EPA. ROW didn't have the stupid system.

The general 996 issues didn't spill over into the 996 GT3s did they? I know the GTs (and maybe Turbo?) had a different engine case altogether but not sure about the rest of the mechanicals...

[sithot]

The case was different (GT1) however I know that the RMS problem has shown up in 997's too.

There are also some potential cooling issues in these cars. Water pumps are known to fail. What I read in one of the rags reminded me of chain tensioners. In this case the writer suggested replacing the water
pump on a regular basis. I can't tell you how many cars I've seen with 6 numbers across the odometer with original water pumps.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5af17YPoRhA

http://sharkwerks.com/porsche/techni...sion-tank.html

http://www.6speedonline.com/forums/9...lant-leak.html

Tom

[runsub5]

As a recent 1973 911S purchaser I am saddened by the events, but everyone of course knew it was coming for years. I don't worry that much about quality going down hill (witness Audi with its beautiful, high quality, well wearing interiors), but I do worry about the dilution of the spirit. I own a 2007 Audi RS4, the last great Audi sedan. It has personality, performance and is built beautifully. Even though a new RS4 is on the way (though probably not in NA), the B7 RS4 cars are actually appreciating (modestly) now, because the new cars don't have the soul of the old cars. I drove Saabs from 1980 to 2006. As did my wife for the first 13 years of our marriage. And I watched what GM did to Saab and I cried and then I left for the world of Audi. VW can learn from the mistakes GM made with Saab, and I hope they do.

Ravi

I drove Saabs for years as well. I just sold my 1991 900 SE convertible, my wife still drives a 2001 9-5 wagon (GM). I agree that Audi leather upholstery is long wearing as I have had two Audis. My current one is a 2003 Allroad. Audi has cheapened the interior over the last few years with cheaply made interior plastic parts that
break and some sort of rubber finish on the instrument panel that wears off near switches during use. Not sure about other Audi models.

[Mr9146]

Gib - I don't think 996s are ugly. They've grown on my over time, and the aero of the GT cars helps.

Tom - I have seen and continue to see numerous Boxster/996/997 variants and, to date, I've seen only one IMS failure. It was in a 997 with 99K miles and owned by a woman who did ZERO maintenance. I met her because she had squeaky brakes ... they were squeaky because ALL 4 corners were past the pad and almost through the metal backing and into the caliper piston! So I attribute what I see to lack of maintenance. By and large I've found the water pumpers to be reliable, good performers that, when properly maintained, provide years of trouble-free service. I think most of the negatives about these cars are sky-is-falling scenarios; one guy reads something on the Internet and it spreads like wildfire until we have the perception of a widespread problem when it's really only a small percentage of the whole. I'm not saying a problem doesn't exist, rather that I've heard more about the problem than I've actually seen roll through the door. And, it's been my experience as well that higher mileage cars are LESS LIKELY to experience the rear main seal issues because the constantly revolving crankshaft doesn't have time to sag. These cars are made to be driven, I suppose. Oh, and finally, water pumps are good for about 40K miles; that's about the lifespan.

In some ways the new cars aren't as good as our old cars, but in many other ways they're far better...I'll take my GT3 in white, please.

[boba]

Gib - I don't think 996s are ugly. They've grown on my over time, and the aero of the GT cars help.

I don't think Gib went quite to ugly. To me they have a kind of 'Toyota' look to them (and I used to own one) without any aero bits. I agree the GT3 and Turbo are the only ones to consider. The electronics will be the long term weak point for all from the 993 on, with each model more exposed. NOS computers and control modules will be gold in 20 years.

[letsrollbabe]

Marco:

Phil has one for sale: http://forums.pelicanparts.com/porsc...-gt3-sale.html It is silver, but it looks to be a very neat car and near your target price.

Another option is to do what you suggested in the '90s R Gruppe 911' thread....put a 6 speed 993 tranny in a good 964 with a few other mods....and then you'll have a 'real 911' that can be serviced and worked on for many, many, years.