Does the price of a restoration increase proportionally with the price our cars?

[peterf]

I’m talking about a good, faithful restoration. Not necessarily concours.
What do you think?

I just noticed that I forgot a word (of) in the title. Can’t seem to fix it myself.

[Chuck Miller]

Does the price of a restoration increase proportionally with the price our cars?

Disregarding the gradual overall increase in the price of 'services/parts/and materials' I think this is a great question.........

[Mr9146]

The cost of a restoration should always be based solely on the price of parts and the cost of the labor (which is directly proportional to the cost of living).

So, a car that requires a lot of rare, hard to find parts will cost more to restore than a car that doesn't, and that's based solely on the differences in the prices of the parts needed to do the job.

All things being equal, the labor costs are the same to restore a 73T and a 73RS.

[oscillon]

I am currently debating what to do with my '66 911 as it will need some tweaking and fixing to make it closer to a #1 car. So this question has certainly crossed my mind very recently.

The barrier to restoration may go down for more cars as the "value" goes up, but I'm not sure if this feeds back into the expense (i.e. what you are charged). I think of my two cars as obvious examples of the conundrum. The 912 is less valuable, but is a more honest car (and worthy) than the 911, but the market driven intrinsic value doesn't currently justify the expense. The 911 is inherently more valued as a collectable car, but has less going for it in the end due to the limited ancillary accompaniment of documentation and a limited record of ownership history.

I guess it really depends on the market and the investment to value ratio and how that is factored into the shop's charges. It seems to me that time/parts/materials are generally subject to nominal increases due to inflation and the availability of parts. However, I can imagine that as the value of these cars increases many restorations will not be done at a per hour scheme, but at a contracted price which makes them subject to that ratio.

$0.02 given

[Craig T]

I believe it does, but simple economic factors of inflation could be the biggest factor.

I saw this when I was into “early” and “mid-year” Corvettes from the late 80's to the late 90's. In 1987 when you could find a rough 67 427 "survivor" for under $25K, you could restore it to NCRS or Bloomington Gold excellent for about $20K-$25k. The finished product was worth about $40K. That’s a near break-even effort that has a good chance of appreciation over time as an investment.

In 1998 when I considered another mid-year big-block resto, the finished cars were worth about $65-$70K. Finding a good car to start with was much tougher, and a decent survivor was $40K. The cost of a good restoration projected to about $60K. $40K+$60K=$70K???...not good math. It no longer made sense (I got smart, took the cash and bought a 993TT...My first Porsche ) That may be were we are now with early 911’s for anything other than a 911S, and doing much of the work ourselves.

You could argue the cost of restoration went up as the price of the early-911’s went up, but it could be simply across the board inflation. Maybe as the price of our cars go up the income of the people buying the cars goes up, therefore they are less sensitive to the cost of restoration and that cost goes up. Supply in demand pricing. I seriously doubt any body shop guy, parts shop, or motor builder makes the conscious decision to raise their prices as the value of the cars increase.

[Eminence Gris]

Back 10+ years ago when I restored a 1957 Chevy Nomad, it became obvious that restoration cost was pretty much the same whether restoring a $100K '57 Bel Air convertible or a $15K 150 4-door sedan.

So, as Marco says, an RS and a T can be pretty much the same cost to restore.

However, restoration is not a monolithic concept. As the owner of a car worth north of $300K, you may be more indulgent with the extra cost of the details. And probably more rigid about 'correctness.' So the result is the same: value leads the decision process and the negotiation. E.g., the throttle shaft play you'll accept on a $40K car is likely more than you'd accept on a $300K car.

[Greg D.]

it is very possible that everyone will want a bigger slice of the pie, if pie does keep on growing - it may not. But so far, as long as we're not talking exotics, my experience has been that it is more regional than value based, assuming the same # of hours required for a project... For example, I paid more to restore a Karmann Ghia in California than a 911T in Florida, 10y apart. Labor rate was 1/2 and honestly just as good. Parts are parts... at this rate we're gonna end up shipping the cars to Poland (seen the metal cobra bodies they do there?) or Vietnam for metal work. I wonder what Paul russell charges per hour on those gullwing restorations...

[luke-44]

Could it simply be that people are inclined and willing to spend more to do the job more thoroughly, given the values are higher today?

Taking the tub down to bare metal and doing a ground up would make more sense now than years ago. Years ago the same car would likely get a much simpler sympathetic restoration.

[Richardnew]

The big variable here are part costs. Labor will be very similar across the various marques. A Camaro paint job will be roughly the same as for a Ferrari. If the quality level is the same. Interior costs are very similar as well. Carpeting installation is carpeting installation. The difference is in the cost of the carpeting. When you get into something like 911S parts costs can be high. If you're doing an RSR get ready for a shocker. The labor cost of replacing a 911S caliper and an RSR caliper should be about the same though.

The we come to a quality variable. a friend had a car done for Pebble Beach. He has 4,000 hours of labor @ $200 per. You do the math. How much quality do you need or want? Pebble Beach (or even PCA) is not going to be a cheap venue.

You're going to be upside down on any restoration. There is simply no way to avoid it.

Richard Newton

[wgwollet]

I agree with Craig T's comments on mid- year vets.

The early 911 are great cars. When you decide to restore one and not to concours level, it can be much more then what the finish product is worth. We can all agree on that, even if YOU do all the work, if it's hired out its a big up-side down. There is nothing wrong with this approach it will take time to recoupe your dollars. Most cars are like that.

Now we see restore shops rebuild the rare cars or 911S and seem to profit by the process. But this is because someone will come forward and pay big dollars for a rare car....money or profit of these buyers is not their main goals.

But let's say you find a 1971 911T coupe, you pay 12-15k, but needs rust repair, paint, mechanicals, etc. this car would set you back in big dollars. For example, Porsche parts are outrageous, this site is a wonderful source for finding these parts, but even so just the gasket kits for these cars is over the top. We know why. After restoring the 71T, it can bring ??, never a payback...but if the author is asking in proportion to the market increasing..... NO....you will always "chase" a good unrestored ( or one in good condition) car purchase ..versus restoring similar cars...