Opinion wanted on an RS "deal"

[GeorgeK]

......................

[neilk]

If someone is misrepresenting a car and you know about it, I think you should tell anyone who will listen. You would hate for anybody you "know" here on the BBS to buy the car only to tell them after the fact that the car isn't what it was made out to be.

However, make sure you are 100% positive that you are correct. Some people might sue you for slander or whatever if your facts aren't totally correct.

[fg1227]

I think this outrageous!! but as value goes up more of these type of situations occur.low milage cars have to be justified with documentation, sevice records,ownership history,or other types od history ;barring that it's all just a crock. it's up to the seller to prove what he says is so;otherwise it isn't

[68'911]

buy it sue him for fruad. you get a car and his house.

[Rennman]

George,

Does this car also happen to be White/ Green?

I think a car should always be acurately represented. I also feel unless someone has physically touched the car opinions should not be in the open. It is not fair to the seller and inacurate statements may push a buyer away on a car that may have been a good one. Just my .06 .

Best,

Don

[RickS]

I whole-heartedly agree, that you should alert the BB members to a potentialy misrepresented car. As stated above, naming names can lead to a slander suit, but pointing out the changes and irregularities certainly won't. Good question and even better you brought it up here.

[D Moran]

I was interested in a car in Europe recently until a very knowledgable person (who also happens to frequent this BB) warned me that, among other things, he had a photo of the odometer showing considerably a higher mileage reading than is now being claimed.

Since there's such a premium on originality it's no surprise that some sellers may succumb to the temptation to falsify it.

George, without publicly naming names can you describe the situation a bit more? For example, color and current location (country)?

[fryardds]

George,

We have both talked about this situation so you know what I think. For the sake of being on the public record I will say that I am dismayed by the issuses you have brought up.

I think it is perfectly acceptable to 'freshen up' an RS with period correct reconditioned or NOS parts as long as it is disclosed and not represented as original. Changing the odometer/speedometer to reflect low mileage is fraud unless the seller is totally ignorant of the change.

Don, your point is well taken in a general sense, but when there is ample photograph evidence to the contrary the seller's lack of disclosure must be challenged and I would think the price should be adjusted accordingly to whoever might be interested in buying it.

This is why I value the relationships I have established through this board, Pelican and RGruppe. If I have a concern about something like this there are a number of honest and impartial people I can turn to for advise and/or information.

[silver911]

The increasing value of these cars means practices like this will increase.
Whilst we on this board may be diligent and knowledgable enough to either know the issues or know where to find honest answers, others, coming into this world with less experience and knowledge may be caught out.

When this happens and a car is sold with information which could mislead not only is the seller blackened but also the Porsche owning and selling community.

If information is avaliable which may help establish the history of a particular chassis number then perhaps it could be made accessible to those who may need this information.
After all if we know a car is being sold as an S when its chassis number says differently we would not hesitate to state our view. This does not mean the seller is dishonest rather that the seller is misinformed.

It could prevent somebody making a large financial mistake and trun a potential enthusiast into an antagonist.

Were I serious about a particular RS I would not hesitate to ask those here and elsewhere with more knowledge and experience than myself for advice and guidance.

HTH

[nick-moss]

The practices that George has outlined are clearly unacceptable and in fact are criminal in the UK. However, and I know that George is not intending this, to publicly announce these activities without proof would be unwise.

Perhaps another slant could be put on this, allowing anyone who is seriously considering the car to find out more of it's real history. If I was to ask if anyone here had information, such as mileage of knowledge of restoration, of a particular car, VIN 91136*****, then the floor becomes open for opinions.

I inspected an RST some months ago that was showing a mileage of 79,000 Km, but when I checked with Autofarm, who keep data on all the cars they come across, they reckoned it had covered 270,000 Km the last time they had seen it some years before. Who knows what the true mileage is, but that is enough to carry out further investigations to clarify the situation.