How many SWTs left

[Jules Dielen]

Is there any kind of count for how many soft window targas are still left in the US? Couple dozen? Couple hundred? A thousand??

[Rotmilky]

171.

I got that based off of 67S numbers. The number of 67S SWTs on the membership registry is 11. Assume half the 67S SWT cars in the US are listed on the registry (probably optimistic, but good enough for a rough estimate). That leaves about 22 67S SWTs still left in the US. According to Peter Morgan's book, 718 SWTs in the S flavor were produced in 67. Assume that half of the 718 were imported to the US. So, 359 would have made it into the states. That means the ratio of surviving targas to total imported in the US is 22/359 = 0.061 -> 6.1 %

I think that's a decent estimate. Cross checking with the 68S targas,for example, I know of at least 4 in the US. Those weren't imported that year, so assume only 10% ever made it over. 442 were produced, so roughly 44 total made it over. The 4 cars that I know of represents about 10% of that number. So roughly 5-10% of the S targas still exist.

Now, once again assuming 50% of the targas produced made it to the US (and using Peter Morgan's production numbers).

67S -> 718 produced = (718/2)*0.061 = 22
67T -> 718 produced = "" = 22
68S -> 442 produced -> 4 known at least in US
68L -> 442 produced = 442 * 0.061 = 27
68N -> 268 produced = 268 * 0.061 = 16
69S -> 614 produced = 614/2*0.061 = 19
69E -> 858 produced = " = 26
69T -> 1282 produced = " = 39
Total left: 171

I stopped counting at 69, but there are a few cars out there in MY70+ that are SWTs. So round up to 200.

Edit: I used total 68L and 68(normal) numbers and left off the 68S (except the 4 known) and 68T numbers. I assumed the L and normal to be US only and the S and T to be euro only.

[Mike Baum]

While I really do not know, I do think the 6.2% estimate of survivors is way too low. We know of at least 6 surviving 1969 S SWT out of a claimed production of 12 for that year.

Granted, a very weak and rather random data point but one that suggests that a higher number probably has survived.

Mike

[mike curnow]

who could possibly care

[beh911]

I care. It's a great question and hard to answer.

Everyone has a formula for estimating survivorship of cars from this era. I've tried to think about it as well here:
http://www.early911sregistry.org/for...-Accounted-For

Somewhere it is tracked, probably not by an enthusiast minded person but more likely data federal databases related to motor vehicles that needs a good sorting.

Now back to the track for day 2 of RRIV. BTW, I've never seen so many early cars in one place. I think an equivalent of the entire east coast population is in the green/blue parking corrals. Amazing site

[Rotmilky]

We know of at least 6 surviving 1969 S SWT out of a claimed production of 12 for that year.

Mike

I'm certainly no expert on 69 numbers, but Peter Morgan's book implies about 600 S targas in '69. Maybe all but 12 were hard windows? Heck, I'm not sure how accurate any of the numbers I got from Morgan's book are.

My 6% was just me goofing around having fun with numbers. It's probably low, but I'd say the numbers are correct to a rough order of magnitude. Just to put upper and lower bounds, say more than 100, less than 1000. I think about 6000 SWTs were produced from 67-69, so even the upper number of 1000 represents only 33-34% of the ~3000 US SWT remaining.

I read the thread on total early cars a few months back. I think the numbers I saw for estimates were in the 10-30% range--well short of Porsche's claims of 70%. Anyone think that there are more than 1000 or less than 100 SWTs left?

[Jules Dielen]

Von - thank you for the insight. I appreciated it. I can see where you are coming from and it does make some sense. I think out of the 268 '68s there are not many left; maybe a dozen max? I can see people trying to save '67 SWT 'S' cars more than a standard 911; that only makes financial sense, or at least it used to.


It would be interesting to get a feel...

[tomkirkcis]

I do not know the answer but there are a few things we do know
Targas are more prone to rust rot due to leaky windows and tops. A coupe may sit outside for years and survive. A SWT with a bad back window won't last 2 years.
Targas were more likely to be junked due to lack of respect. Let's face it. Targas have not been as well respected in the 911 community as their coupe counterparts, and still aren't, except for the SWTs which have developed a cult following as of late.

In regard to 67S, I have seen a production breakdown with 483 Targas. I was communicating with other owners and am aware of about 5 in special order "blood Orange". If there are 5 in a special order color that I know of, my gut tells me 100 world wide seems reasaonable
Tom

[curtisaa]

To answer this question empirically the facts are this :

According to Porsche , they never kept track of Targas' with hard windows VS soft windows. However, I was just at Rennsport 4 and there was only one SWT in the designated area for SWT's only. So, stating that I really believe that there is NO accounting anywhere to "how many" then the question remains active ??

This becomes a guessing game. I, personally have owned and completely restored a few SWT's. Keep in mind, there's a small crowd of buyers that get these cars. Personally, I equate these small production versions to " collectable" Porsches.

If you own one , two, or three, KEEP them.

The caveat is : It really does NOT matter if the SWT is a 911 or 912 ! These cars are VERY collectable and deserve they're recognition !!!

[flat six]

I saw a black SWT on I10 near palm springs last Sunday. Looked clean. Great color!